Squad numbers 1, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13, 14, 16 all not playing.

Yes Widnes wouldn't have been full strength either, but not to that extent.

Widnes had Hanbury, Ottio, Inu, Runciman, Ah Van, Dudson, White, Gerrard, Houston, Cahill, Craven, Leuluai, Albert and Heremaia out who are all first team players.

So without our best player, our best 3 props and best 2 hookers.

No doubting Wire had some missing too but your strength in depth should be much better considering your resources.

We're obviously still looking around - comment fro the press conference...

I have to side with VW1.

Our starting 13 were all names you'd expect to see in our 19 man squad throughout the season. All have many many SL minutes behind them. Our bench aaide, this was a strong experienced team. When they were warming up, Widnes genuinely looked like school kids compared to our guys. Widnes had a far weaker team on paper. It's particularly disappointing as you'd have hoped some.of these players would have shown some bite to squeeze into the reconning.

However, our problem areas tonight were in the areas where we have better players to come in. Patton and particularly Livett were poor (both poor decision making, Livett poor execution too), but we have 2 better halves to come in for them (plus Ratch as a 3rd pivot which JJ didn't provide). Our seemed to forget they had a winger outside them, but again Atkins and Goodwin will.come in (Goodwin went off injured after 15).

A further positive was our forwards. While it was obvious they were not going 100%, Cooper, G King and Philbin all made some good go-forward with the ball.

We’ve just come straight off a fatiguing army camp, probably haven’t done much skills work either. NRL teams are always rubbish pre-season against SL teams (see last year) but they come good when it counts. I trust Price’s judgment on this one.

I have no idea how we’ll play next season, but I’m not concerned by a loss on a cold winters night in a meaningless fixture. We won last year and what good did that do?

Agreed, good post. Fair play to widnes especially the youngsters. The result never really means anything preseason, sure its nice to build a bit of confidence but it doesn't matter. I'm sure Steve price may be a bit dissapointed with some aspects and performances but I really doubt he will be writing anyone off for being a bit off colour at this stage and neither should we.

If no one's concerned like I keep reading, then bring back the Wardonia cup vs the Pies.
It'll mean something then!

The first few games of the season will tell us a lot, like it did last season.

It took a good few years for us to sink into our 2017 level and it will take a few to climb out of it.

We finished top and made two finals in 2016 but I appreciate that expectations were higher when TS was here and now he has gone, mid table will be seen as a decent achievement.

There was a of fortune on our side while misfortune lay on the side of most other perennial contenders in 2016.
We didn't deserve to be in the finals...2016 and 17 have gone down as one of the most disappointing seasons in SL.

At least when we're rubbish, we knew where we stood...and our expectations was one of hope nor disappointment.

Sally, I am not sure about that .....mid table will be disappointing for me. I don't expect to win everything but expect to be more than just reasonably competitive.

The decline I am talking of was of squad quality, rugby quality and entertainment value. Of course Price gets expectations lowered for 2018 - he has only been here 8 weeks - not 8 years.

So long as he doesn't put us into the 2nd tier of rugby again and walk about with a stinking CBA attitude that will be improvement.

We finished 1 point from making the Super 8s last season after having a woeful season. With the recruitment that we have made and with the return of Ben Currie and also the re-starting of Dom Crosby's career at Wire, I am more than confident of a top 4 finish.

You can claim fortune or misfortune in a one off game but you don't finish top over a 30 game season through being lucky.

Anyway I would have said TS was the one with the bad luck - how many times did he have top players lined up to be signed but then things fell through at the last minute?

Of course you can....2016 was a perfect example....we were shat and got lucky....2017 echoed it without the luck...luck not being a word I like to use but your Dad Tony Smith does.
Leeds were the total opposite...they were decimated and finished like us in 17....but their team at that back end would have walked the gf, you could see they were had and shoulders superior, had they have not had a poor run of injuries.
We were feckin lucky against Halifax...and utterly moral losers vs London.

Putting it blunt we were feckin disgraceful.