have you tried the....never mind.

i'd assume so he hasn't been cup-tied this season obviously unless there is a clause in his contract.

I wouldn't think so, I don;t believe the dual registration players will play in the cup so they aren't cup tied in case their own club needs them in later rounds.

Having said that, aren;t there two cup deadlines nowadays?

well Why make that comment then ?.... it could be used when fans talk about Langer or Johns or Jonathan Davies or etc etc .........I just thought it unnecessary especially about a kid with a future in the game...

And if you want to get people really starry eyed just mention one season wonder Richard Henare.....

the point is that he is still a player at the club.. Langer, Johns and Davies are not.

He played in a team that underachieved and didn't win anything.... now we have a team, who you could argue, are not underachieving.... and the challenge cup in the cabinet.

There are players that were part of both the underachieving team and the trophy winning team.. Penny isn't one of them.

Paul Wood didn't play in the final - does that make him an underachiever? How about Dave Solomona, how many domestic medals has he won - does that mean he's an underachiever? Lee Briers, 1 medal in 13 years - underachiever?

Your argument is based on the fact that you don't like Kevin Penny, fair enough, but you seem to struggle with coming up with facts to back up your opinion & persuade others to change their minds...

Where did i say he is an underachiever? i said that he played in a team that underachieved, which he no longer appears to be a part of.

Paul Wood and Lee Briers were also part of that underachieving squad.. but they are also part of Tony Smith's first team squad.. THATS the point I am trying to make.

Where am i struggling to come up with facts? The only fact I have pointed out is that the coach his deemed him not good enough for the first team.

I'm not trying to change anyone's mind. Why do i need to?

For the record I like Penny.. i hope he comes back a better player, forces his way back into the first team and lives happily ever after... I just wish people would stop bleating on about how 'badly' he has been treated by the supporters.

You seem convinced he is "quite clearly not" a better player than Chris Riley - how do you come to this judgement? Penny took his chance with spectacular style in 2007. Chris Riley has taken 4 years to become an overnight sensation. When Henry Fa'afili was here, he only scored so many tries (in many opinions) because he was playing outside Martin Gleeson - so is Riley only scoring so many because of his service? Is Penny only as good as the service that he receives? Yes - wind back 2 years when he was favourite to be top try scorer in SL & look at the mistakes he made; how many of them came when he was abandoned to defend 1 v 3 by his centre & 2nd row partners (Matt King & Louis Anderson). Who's to say he wouldn't be performing as well as Riley has this year with the change to defensive structure TS has brought?

I agree he needs to be playing regular SL to regain his confidence & the move to Quins will be good for him. I just hope he isn't another player we lose to another SL club permanently. He is more exciting a player than Chris Riley, Chris Hicks & Rhys Williams ever will be, and at the end of the day we are spectators in an entertainment business.

Surely if Penny was 'finished' at Warrington, Mr Smith would have got rid of him by now or loaned him out for the season and not just for a month.

He didn't want Gleeson so he got rid.

In that season teams pinpointed Pennys side of the pitch as a weakness they could exploit. I agree that a lot of it was down to King's woeful defending/positioning (and Anderson to an extent).. I think in this current side Penny would probably have scored all of riley's tries.. and probably a few extra ones as well... You wont find any argument from me that he is a more exciting player than all of the other wingers at the club.

i said he is quite clearly not a better player than Riley because of how far down the pecking order he now finds himself... maybe TS feels that the defensive structure wouldn't be the same with KP in the team.. who knows what his thinking is..

I watched Penny a number of times last season for the under 20's/18's/ reserves and to say his performances looked lackluster would be an understatement.... like i said though... must be hard dropping down to that level from hat-tricks and SL dream team selection... maybe it was these performances that influenced smiths decision... maybe it's how he trained... we will probably never know.

Chris Riley is average on a good day. Bring Penny back! I'd pay an extra £10 to watch him. Id watch Quins on sky before the Wire now.

Warrington is full of idiots, well half full anyway

Let him just sign for Saints etc and have done with it.

Ps. He's not the most exciting winger at the club, he's the most exciting player. But Warrington have a defeatist mentality. The Man City of SL pre Arab owners.

hmmm, out of Warrington and Man City, which has most recently won a major trophy...

kev penny 4 britain 2k10 kk?

Anything said tonight about Kev?