Two points, one, players would go for salaries that are more guaranteed than those with bonuses. That is common in football (was mentioned in an interview with david james i believe when asked about bonuses).

And secondly, i didn't think we liked mercenaries playing for the club?

Prior to the start of the season I thought the situation of having a lot of players playing for contracts this season would have helped improve player performance. Clearly not.
Having thought about it a fair bit over the last 4 weeks I have come to the conclusion that players are playing for themselves. If you are playing for your future income you might be more inclined to go for the glory play, (See the Lee Penny school of 2 on one attack).
I know that in theory they shouldnt but is it in the back of a players mind that they need to shine sometimes at the detriment of the team?

I don't quite see what is mercenary about it??...



The way I see it, there are 2 possible scenarios...

1. For example, Matt King gets paid £100k a year guaranteed, whether the club finishes 1st, 7th or 14th.

Or,

2. Matt King gets £50k a year guaranteed, and a further £50k in bonuses depending on the team's performances on he pitch...(Make up your own qualifying scheme)

I think example 1 makes him a mercenary, you seem to think number 2 does??

No my point is, there is no chance a player would choose the second option as the first is guaranteed where as the second one, they could end up with o nly half. Surely that makes sense?

My second point was entirely separate point that refers to the fact surely we do not want people coming to the club to top up their pension and not care about the club.

So that just about takes into account the majoirty of the population, or should professional sportsmen only play for the teams they love and for the game, in the same way that we all go to work beacuase we love our companies and the business we are in?

I don't think being a professional sportsman with the potential adulation of the paying public, the hero-worship of the local youngsters and the possibility of glory when winning trophies is the same as working on the till in Asda.

It's all relative though Mark. We can't expect players to play for their home town club for less money all the time. I mean who would want to play for us?

And that's why they do it is it? If Aldi paid them more they'd go there.

That's true. Jamie Lyon signed for St Helens on a 2 year contract, knowing all the while that he had a confirmed offer from Manly waiting for him when his Paramatta contract expired and he was allowed back into the NRL. He could have come over and hidden like Monaghan or holidayed like King, but he was arguably the most enthusiastic and determined overseas player I've seen at Saints.

That's true, but I think in most people's cases, if they performed as badly in their jobs as most of the Wire team presently are, they would probably be sacked by now for gross incompetence!!

Sports teams are a totally different kettle of fish, simply because they are getting the rare opportunity to do a job they actually love, and indeed a job that's rewards include the possible adulation of thousands....Comparing them with Joe Public doing something mundane like delivering the mail, or driving the bus is an insult to all supporters who pay their wages.

but is that because he knew he'd only be playing in the hole for 2 years whereas monas is here for 4. I also fail to see how anyone can call Warrington a holiday!!

I would sincerely hope not. Let me get this right; you are saying professional sportsmen do it purely for the money?

That would only work if it was only him playing badly, it isnt!

Its the whole team!

Hes playing badly cous others are.

...I've often thought this....Imagine the horror King must have felt when he first arrived in Warrington....'4 years in this dump!!'...



The problem is, in the most part, these guys sign the contracts without even visiting the places they are going to be moving to, and let's face it, the north of England, especially at this time of year, must be a massive culture shock to even the most hardened Aussie.

Without seeming to defend them, its easy to see why many Aussies get homesick....

A lot of this comes down to personal pride.

In all walks of life there are those with an immense amount of pride in what they do, and others who saunter along getting away with as much as they can.

I used to work with two drivers who would both leave the depot at 8am with 40-50 deliveries each. Neither round was more or less difficult than the other, yet every day driver A was back mid afternoon and helped out in the warehouse until hometime. Driver B would trundle in at hometime (give or take 5 minutes). Driver A's appearance and van were always immaculate inside and out, Driver B was constantly being reminded to wash his van and clear out all the old crisp packets and coke cans and he looked a mess.

No doubt RL players are no different. Some will put everything into every training session, every play of every match, regardless of who they are playing for or against. Others wont.

Were Driver A & B on the same pay??....



Seriously, there could be some at Wire looking at others and thinking 'He's on twice what I'm on, and he's awful...why should I bother??'...

Same basic, but guess who was top of the list when overtime came up?

[size=75[Answer - it was me![/size

Who was it at Hull KR who has just signed a new deal? Was it Newton?

How long was his contract when he first signed for them?

Yeah, right on both counts.

I was just wondering because it seems he's come over and earned his new deal, although it's always better to plan for the long term, he's come over on a short(ish) deal, played very well and earned his new deal which will tie him down for how long, three more years, was it?

Just going off Sally's post on the first page, Newton came over with a fairly low reputation, when compared to his former teammate King anyway, and he's come over to a club with big ambitions, and quite obviously matched their ambitions and earned himself a new deal. It's always hard to tell with these things, but a lot of people say if we're going overseas, we should sign players like Dobson, at a good age with a low reputation; players just looking to play footy (sounds so Aussie, for some reason). This seems to be something we're getting wrong quite often, we've signed players like Hicks, who have come over, impressed and although he's old, he could be on track to earn a new deal. But then we've signed players like King, Mona's and Vinnie Anderson, it might just be me, but they've not impressed half as much as I was expecting them to do, whereas Hicks has in a way, over-impressed.

I know big names get the crowds in, but I'd like to think if we had a well-managed, hard working side with ambitions to match the club, then we'd have a side competing for honours, which I feel would bring in bigger crowds.

For me, although it's harder to plan long-term, it's better to give players shorter contracts, and make them earn extensions. Keep them on their toes, then once you know that they have the commitment, give them a longer deal, like Westwood, it just seems that with players like King, Monaghan and Vanderson, who all signed for 3 years+ (I think so anyway), that they're happy earning their salary and aren't matching that on the field.

Are you saying that the vast majority of the population work purely for the money?

This may come as a surprise to you but many people would place job satisfaction, recognition, enjoyment, working as part of a team and pride in what they are doing as being more important than money. Money is there just to pay the bills. And those are just factors of 'everyday' jobs and not that of a professional sportsman who (should) have a host of other reasons... maybe competitiveness and desire to succeed?

Put it this way, if all the Warrington players are here solely just to pick up a wage we will never win anything. That just isn't motivation enough.

That's a simple misnomer though, the job of a Rugby player isn't just to play on a game day, that's the pinnacle of their weeks work.



That's a fans perspective of wanting to be a sportsman and idolising what they do, who they are or who they play for. In reality most sportsmen are good at their chosen sport and they are rewarded for their level of competence. They no doubt work hard to get where they are and to get better, but so do lots of other people in all walks of life and jobs. The fact that people pay to see what they do doesn't make them any different to anyone else, we just want them to be something more.



I think it's more insulting to suggest that someone who delivers mail or drives a bus is any less deserving of praise, I personally think someone who is responsible for a number of lives, such as a bus driver, should hold equal if not more respect than someone who plays a game for a living. But that's now how society works though is it?

We want heroes, we want people capable of doing something we can't, we want to live vicariously through them and belong to a tribe. We create their status and are equally apalled when those that we build up fall down. Who do professional Rugby League players idolise? How many would love to be footballers with all the glamour and money?

It doesn't suprise me at all, you're almost getting the point now!



If you have the job you desire and the money is good enough to "just pay the bills" then that may be the case, there are all too many people in this country and the rest of the world where money is the be all and end all simply becuase they don't have enough, either through poverty or greed.

Competitiveness and desire to succeed exists in all areas of employment, if it didn't then most companies wouldn't exist.



You see the problem is, very simply, perception. We hold our players in esteem for what they do and who they play for.

Nowadays a sportsman doesn't know any other way, that's invariably all they have ever done. They haven't been to job interviews or sent out CV's or spent years in education. Most have an appreciation of what a "normal" job entails, but essentialy they are here solely for our need, they live in their own world which has it's own unique challenges. Some have great difficulty in adapting after their time in sport, but very simply put, they are the same as everyone else who works and have the same wants and desires and suffer from the same problems.

That is a good point and this is where the supporter has probably become alienated from the professional sportsman (even more more with typical premier league players). This is a world away from the time when RL players held down a regular job and would then see playing the game as a privelige and a release from the working week.