Yet again, FFS, read my post, I named At least 8 of our starting 17 that didn't play yesterday.

Doesn't really work though when we were missing 14 - Hodgson, Chris Bridge, Atkins, Joel Monaghan, Briers, Myler, Morley, Michael Monaghan, Waterhouse, Westwood, Harrison, Grix, Ratchford, Hill.

It shows that putting the time, effort and money into youth development does work and provides great strength in depth.

don't get me wrong you've upped your game immensely in that department and hopefully for the game it will pay immense dividends. But lets face it for the amount of time spent in Super League Warrington have hardly led the charge here!

That's correct. In the early 2000's we were miles behind. We identified it, rectified it, and we're reaping the rewards. We've won trophies in each of the last 4 years and home grown players have played a massive part in that. We're likely to win, or compete for, trophies for the next 10 years. Expect, at least, 50% of our 17 each week to be academy products.

I think lolling at this point is a bit like doing a Nelson Muntz about 12 years too late.

We had 6/7 of our home grown lads playing yesterday who by and large will get regular game time this season. Granted you had a lot of young lads out there who were impressive but when the names off your list, of which I'd say only one at best is home grown are available, how much gametime will the younger lads get?

Not a tremendous amount next season - one of the awkward side effects from having a team that was about 20 minutes away doing the double. As players retire, these will replace them. Evolution.

Well yes, that's what it should be about but in reality, after all this time in SL I'd have thought your 17 would include a lot more of your academy products. I'd say 4/5 of your regular 17 are home grown? We're in the position of having to play them along with a greater percentage of 'signings' due to our recent history.

We've put a lot of effort into youth ourselves and we have 1st team regulars who are youth development products and that's after not having the 'pick' of the youth in the game due to being out of SL for so long.

Oh, also I'd say out of Listers list of non starters for you, I'd say there were just as many Widnes academy players as there were Wire

!

Yet again you missed my point. I was never contesting the fact ho many players you were missing? I was contesting the fact that it WAS NOT near a fully fit widnes side that you beat. Obviously we had a mix of first team players in there but far far from our starting team.

Why? We were on our knees in 2001 - we were playing in a ground which cost us a 6 figure sum each year just to exist in. Our average gates were, what, about 6k? We were trying to move stadiums to safeguard our future. We had practically no youth development at all really, save for the odd lucky rafting. We had to create a fans group, Squadbuilder, to help grow that part of the club. Turning that around in 10 years to the point where almost 1/3 of our team are home grown is pretty good going. As I say, this will continue to improve - expect Currie to become a regular first teamer in 2013 - he's got the lot. We're still not where we need to be but we will get there. There were 8 home grown players in the team that dismantled yours last Easter remember.

The other point I made is valid. We have an excellent team, it's that much more difficult for players to break through. O'Brien would walk into your team. Actually, he did. He's on the fringes of ours because he has Myler, Briers and Ratchford in front of him (although Ratchford will replace Hodgson at FB so its Briers' shirt he should be after). I appreciate that may make me sound like an **** but honestly, that's not my intention - but it does illustrate my point rather.

As for having the pick of youngsters, I'm sure that will get easier the more established you become in SL/the top flight. If you're still here in 10 years, and there's no reason to suspect you won't, the quality will improve. One thing is 100% true - widnes' approach to recruitment and youth this time round is so much better than your last stint in SL.

My initial point by the way was more about certain Wire fans trying to preach they are the model youth club when in reality as later stated your only just starting to look at that talent pool as your first port of fall for back up players. Which is great and will he good to see how the likes of Currie, Evans and O'Brien (not sure he'd be first choice half at us but still quality and would most sides outside playoffs).

Warrington's first 13 would have what Riley maybe Harrison who count as home grown in the lineup? So still a way to go but still good progress. Leeds, Saints and Wigan have showed that powerful youth production is the main guarantee of sustained success. Tony Smith now seems to have took this view / been instructed too.

Makes the new academy changes even more ridiculous!

What Ian 77 Redux said. At our lowest point we closed down the A team to save money. It has taken a long time to repair that damage, but the youth policy has now been there for a few years and is paying dividends.

^ J20

Pretty much what I was getting at. Don't get me wrong, Wire look like they now have a great youth set up to complement a great first team but it's my opinion that your youth, considering the resources you now have at your disposal should be making greater inroads into your 1st team. Currie does indeed look like the real dal.

I take your point about where you were in 2001 but that is nowhere compared to where we've been yet we are producing/have produced more SL 1st team regulars than you have and arguably an equal amount of your own 1st team as you have!!