It's a bit like saying Riley is a winger as he had never played a first team game at fullback. Capiche?

Yes, but you need the necessary skills. Mathers is no more a standoff than Wellens is, the suggestion of either being a proven 6 is ludicrous. Sure, you could shoe them there and they'd do a job more than say shoving Morley there but is doesnt make them a 6.

You analogies with Eastmond and Wellens are also incredibly poor. Wellens' halfback days were at the very start of his career and after establishing himself as a regular player has found his position. Eastmond is just on the journey to becoming established. Mathers on the other hand has played lots of rugby for numerous teams none of which have felt that he is a stand off. He isnt just going to magically transform into one.

Your man Wheeler today when asked post game, said that he sees his future at six, but he's happy to play centre. It may be that he makes a success of centre for the next two years, but he'd still think he's a six, given that's where he played his junior rugby, but he'll be more than happy to play centre, to be in the side.

Mathers played plenty of six in junior rugby, he was 'spotted' if you will playing at six, I think his opportunity in SL for Leeds came at fullback, and he moulded himself into the role, now that's probably his primary position, but he must still have that ability to play six as his junior rugby was spent there. Pryce left Bradford for such an opportunity to play in his preferred position.

So using that analogy, James Graham is also a standoff because we have no evidence to contradict that.

Yes, I understand that concept. However Wheeler is a kid and where he ends up is anyones guess. Mathers is an established player, and a fullback at that. He isnt some developing youngster who may or may not end up elsewhere.

Ah, now i get it.

Agreed.

Moving Lockyer to stand-off in 2004 (when he was 27) was a ridiculous decision: he was a fullback and should have remained so.

I have emperical evidence that Mathers has played standoff, can the same be said of Graham?

Are you implying Pryce should never play stand off at Saints as he hadn't really done so at Bradford?

So you have to be supremely talented to play stand-off? How do amateur teams cope? 12-a-side?

You are a fecktard.

No. You had evidence that a jonny youngster was shoved into a position probably to fill a gap. That happens a lot, it doesnt make that player an established player in that position.



Thats not what Im saying. What Im saying is before you can band them as a player of that position they have to prove themselves in that position. Pryce had to do this and plenty of people for the first year or so made declarations that he wasnt a 6. Some still do. Mathers may go on to do this, who knows but up to now he is no more a 6 than any other random back that you could pick.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Mathers is a player who can play fullback and stand off. Nobody is saying he is one or the other. Myself, nor anybody else is picking any random back, hence my comment about Riley playing wing and fullback. He is a fullback who can play stand off, is it really that difficult to comprehend?

Im not being obtuse at all, its common sense. He is a fullback. He has played all his senior career as a fullback. The fact that he played as a kid at 6 or that you could play him 6 does not make him one. That would be like me saying Wellens is a 6 or a centre. He could play there, he would do ok but he isnt a centre or a standoff, he is a fullback. Its not that hard.

Is the correct answer.