I don't have a problem with them doing intense fitness work in the off season, but you don't have to do it in the pitch black up rocky hills with uncertain footing. All it takes is one wrongly placed foot and a snapped ankle and a player's out for half the season or more.

Anyway I'm not going to get too worked up about it at this point, we will find out whether the pre-season work was good or not when we watch them in the regular season.

Different approaches to pre-season get seen as genius or gimmicks depending on how the team plays. In recent years, Hull KR and Salford have been on these army camps, had media stories about it in the off season, then still went on to have rubbish seasons.

Lefty brings up an interesting example with Hanley. Hanley didn't bother with gym work. He designed his own fitness programme based around circuits and a medicine ball, and played squash. He was his own personal strength conditioning coach, sports psychologist, video analyst, and contract negotiator. These days clubs hire all sorts of people and the players have everything prepared for them but I wonder how many have the personal initiative to work out what they really need to do to get the best out of their careers. Hanley was probably seen as a man apart by his team mates and coaches but will have got away with it because they knew he could be trusted to prepare himself in top condition for everything.

Shaun Edwards methods were different but he was out of the same mould of single-minded intensity at preparing himself. Imagine having a dressing room with those two, plus Dean Bell, the example that would set to the others. If we had those three now in our team now we would win everything like Wigan did. But in terms of natural talent I don't think those three were anything abnormal in the world of rugby league, probably some of our current squad have got a better range of RL skills than they did. They just were on a different level in terms of intelligence and drive.

John Woods never trained.
He walked his dogs over the hills by Leighvery day and had a very long almost injury free career...not to mention one of the most naturally talented British footballers ever.

The doubt the army camp adds much to the skill and physic levels of the players.
However team bonding and a brother sense will be strengthened.
I'm not sure a holiday environment creates that ethic.

Have to agree with this, I don't think being captain suits hill, he spends far too much time complaining to the referee and getting involved in the niggly stuff giving away silly penalties. He is best left to concente on his main job which he did with aplomb at the world cup for England (with no armband to worry about).

Club captain definitely, but I'd rather someone else on game day so we can see the best of hill again. I wouldn't be surprised to see Cooper given the nod by Steve Price.

Yes I’d forgotten about Cooper, great call. Local lad, intelligent and disciplined.

....and completely out of form.

....few like being told what to do by someone who isn't or cannot do it themselves.
Cooper will struggle to gain the respect. In many cases the best have earned it.

I thought you had given everyone a clean slate

I agree with your thoughts but I wouldn't be surprised if Steve price doesn't have cooper as a captaincy candidate due to what he saw from him when he signed him for St George. He went very well for them in the NRL.

Price is no mug, I am sure he will choose the best man for the job in terms of the leadership he wants.

They've all got a clean slate...however the captaincy must come go to a historical senior figure for respect... isn't that difficult to earn that from a clean slate?

Was Brown captain for his 4 years at Widnes? He certainly has leadership qualities. He’s used to being behind on the scoreboard, just not coming from behind to win.

I'd ideally like to it be a player that is on the pitch all the time, one that orchestrates plays.

The last player we had like that was Briers.

Morley was Captain but Briers directed everything.

It appears Army Camps are well established in the NRL. To include sleep deprivation and "torture" St George Illawarra Dragons - https://www.dragons.com.au/news/2017/01 ... boot-camp/ Gold Coast Titans - https://www.nrl.com/news/2015/11/25/tit ... ture-test/ Melbourne Storm - https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-pr ... f253a44307 South Sydney Rabittohs - https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport ... cfead34d61

It appears Army Camps are well established in the NRL. To include sleep deprivation and "torture" St George Illawarra Dragons - https://www.dragons.com.au/news/2017/01 ... boot-camp/ Gold Coast Titans - https://www.nrl.com/news/2015/11/25/tit ... ture-test/ Melbourne Storm - https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-pr ... f253a44307 South Sydney Rabittohs - https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport ... cfead34d61

Tell me about it.....