I think if it was really important to win that game then Monas jr, Carvell, Briers, Atkins, Hodgeson and probably Grix and Westwood would all have played and yes, we would have won that game.

We lost because we 'rested' too many key players. We got thrashed because several good players had dreadful games, plus 3 players were returning from months out. It is a result that you get at the extreme end of playing a squad rotation system. More typical would be a 24-20 win or a narrow loss.

It was a depressing game to watch, in fact it was humiliating. But the fact remains that the play-offs do not reward teams that win most of their regular games, it penalises them because they have to use their best players week in week out. At the end of the season you arrive with a team that has lost its edge (or has injuries to key players). Rotation does not guarantee success but it weighs the odds in your favour. Wigan are using the same tactics.

I agree what the fans need to do is send a message by turning up in droves to the league fixtures and not turning up to the playoffs.

Given that the playoffs and especially Grand Final are hugely popular and create a lot of excitement it doesn't exactly send a signal to the game's organisers that it is failing, does it.

They responded to the fact the fans didn't care about the Lancashire v Yorkshire fixtures by scrapping it but to be honest its only Warrington fans, in the last couple of seasons, that have been bitching about the playoffs. Even we were never that bothered up till last year, I don't remember it ever being a topic on this board before.

Mind you I remember "why did we lose to motherclucking Salford" being a topic on these boards before, more or less every year, it's just only this year that we decided we lost to them because we threw the game on purpose because it didn't matter. Of course when it comes to the playoffs you will see a difference because Warrington will take those games seriously there's no danger that we will end up underperforming in the playoffs, that's when we rise to the occasion...

Actually the playoffs, people don't turn up to watch. The final is a final which always attracts a bigger crowd.

The way this will be resolved will be through simple supply and demand, no need to worry.

Given the premise, as the league games decline in importance, then fans will stop buying season tickets despite better grounds. If they decide that their team are not going to play at the top of their game for enough games on the season, they will just turn up like the players for big fixtures and leave the rest to TV or read the results on the net.

If crowds do decline for regular rounds, clubs will feel this in their pockets as actually clubs as financial bodies have very little interest in the playoffs as it does not add as much to the revenue as 13 weekly rounds.

If clubs feel it in their pockets, big clubs through fewer season tickets, smaller through less away fans turning up.

Then their chief execs who make the rules for SL, will then change said rules.

Preaching to the converted here.

We could reduce the number of teams, we could also by default reduce teams income, and potential sponsorship by reducing the number of games. This would ruin the 4 teams kicked out but that's by the by. for me the fact we can;t produce 14 teams of 13 players without having second rate players or imports to top the teams up is the single biggest embarrassment rugby league has.

How about this for a radical idea - Why not invest in coaching better coaches at amateur and club junior levels, to make them better and give them the skills to regularly produce enough talent to fill 14 clubs, and not have to supplement our squads with overseas players and second rate e. who knows we may even be able to produce 17 from that lot who can do alright against other countries.

Maybe the strings of the superleague guitar have been tuned to breaking point...this could be as good as superleague will ever be... imo we simply don't have enough players involved in the game at the moment for a quick fix. The only way for improvement is through the clubs bringing players in as is happening now but it will take time to happen. The other route of a lift in salary cap to attract the Aussies would cost too much & be the road to ruin for sl because of increased admission charges ,people now will not pay for games not covered by the season ticket so what chance would there be of getting people to pay possibly double for a season ticket to cover imported players wages. The only way forward is to stick with the kids & let the game we have find its own level of quality...we have lagged behind the Aussie game for years & apart from getting beat in test matches has it really spoiled our enjoyment of our game ? Don't forget Australians have a different attitude to sport & all things involving getting physical than the British so we are never going to be as good as them anyway...i am sure if RL Test matches were played on X Box we would be world champions.
Bring on the youngsters !

For me it has to be a top 5 play off. I remember in the first few years the intensity of the games and passion was immense between Bradford, wigan, saints and leeds +1, now it's pretty poor and I've felt the same for some time, regardless of our involvement.

I think if we are being honest, the league season is dying on its backside, and it isn't helped by a top 8 play off system.

I've actually stopped watching games on telly, purely because there is little intensity or excitement in the games....Teams lose and the coaches just shrug (or laugh in TS's case) and go on about how its a long season and not to start worrying until the 'business' end of the campaign.

I think if the sport isn't careful crowds will begin to drop, as folk realise that the league season is just one long pre season warm up, with the season being a 4 week period in Sept/Oct.

I'm not 100% sure on how to remedy this - The play offs isn't a bad idea, its just in its present guise it lends itself to mediocrity for the majority of the season - I'd probably favour a 10 team top division with a top 5 play off, with a 10 team second division, which would provide a 1 up, 1 down promotion/relegation, which would then serve to give an interest to those sides at the bottom end of the table.

I am rapidly losing interest. Keep forgetting about the Monday night games as well. Put them back on Saturday!

Fans don't want to watch youngsters though, unless they are quality ones like Wigan, Leeds etc.

If Warrington picked a team like they did against Salford every week, watch how quickly the attendances would collapse.

But when the talked about NRL salary cap increase eventually comes in ,surely the quality of decent Aussies available for superleague will plummet to the real over the hill brigade who will be an even worse option than our kids.

Incidentally,Monday night games ,4500 at Widnes last night how does that compare to a weekend fixture ?

The players were good enough. The tactics were'nt. Cooper at left second row for the majority of the game? 3 players coming back from long term absence in one game? These were the problems not the age or quality of the players.

You are right Sal, if it was not for some of our senior players we could have got thrashed.

Those ball handling skills of Woody were fantastic, he must have glue on his finger tips. And Bridge, well his offloads were unbelievable. Morley - I can not remember him making less than 20m when he had ball in hand.

Bobwire above has it spot on IMO, it was a 'bad day at the office' for the team, combined with the return of 3 players with no SL matches in months.

That depends on other teams doing the same. Putting kids against a side full of Aussies you are always on to a loser, but all teams should be promoting youth.

I totally agree i thought you lot had the best u20s side , sorry got to agree got to promote youth and you have a lot of talent and think alot of your u20s team would be playing first team at most other clubs in other words your Blessed with youth dont knock it!!! you have always compared yourselves to wigan youth over the years and now you have the youth you want to shut door ! Be proud of what you have got cause one things for sure your the Envy of most other superleague clubs

Discipline , loose carries , bad options cost you the game , salford for sure have proved there youth teams have massively improved over the last 2 yrs solomona vastly overweight unfit surely cant be in Tony smiths plans for next year !!! Reminded me of owen Craige who played for us