Collectively that's a lot of failure Shiny. Nearly wins you nowt.

Super League as a whole has been in decline for quite a few years now. We're hardly the only ones who are much weaker on paper than what we were two or three years ago.

Didn't we have a very good chance of beating Leeds iirc in the GF till everyone's favourite pantomime villain started trouble in midfield & disrupted our attack.Then Leeds went up our end & scored again. ?

Or the Childs and Silverwood (?) show in the 2011 Semi Final.. luck does have a lot to do it, but at some point we have to stop finding excuses and win the darn thing.

We've played some great rugby since TS took over and won a fair few trophies without winning the GF.
I want a GF win - even if it has to be ugly.
But I wouldn't want us playing crap rugby all the time.
(Sorry but I hate the way Wigan play even though they've won lots without arguably being the best team - it's an old chestnut of mine).

If tony smiths grand final record was 2 wins 3 grand final defeats then talk of getting rid would be misplaced but it's not he has only managed to get us to the grand final 3 times in his time with us and lost those

When was the last time you thought, "Wow, we are playing great rugby".

Nothing arguable about it at the moment, Wigan are head and shoulders the best team presently.

We seem to think along the same lines, but I don't want to win a GF if we have to do it ugly. We need to do it our way, (as hard as it may seem at the minute) playing the attractive expansive rugby that we are known for.

Yes, and prior to TS taking over getting to a GF was just a pipedream for this club. We do need to become champions, no doubt, but TS's record as coach of Warrington is the best we've had sinnce the 1950s, barring our 'golden' 1973-74 season.

This is very true, but are you not judging by a historic comparison rather than an a current comparison with our peers?

The financial clout and expectations of the club are very different post 2009 than they were at any point since the 1950's.

Like it, or like it not, TS has had the backing of the board, finances, time and full support of the fans to deliver a GF at some point in the last 8 years - and he hasn't. There is no escaping that he has failed to achieve the No1 objective.

Wigan, Leeds, Saints would not retain a coach with such record in my view. So the question is - why should we?

This was to widen the discussion. I have already posted about 'current context', my view essentially is that sacking TS without having a clue as to where we would find a better coach is not an option, and no-one has come onto this board to date with a convincing suggestion as to who such a better coach might be.

Unless users on here are professional RL administrators or agents - we will struggle to know how the land lies with international recruitment opportunities. so we can only speculate. A bit like when Cullen was axed, we didn't know we would get Smith, we just knew Cullen had to go. Using your argument though he would have stayed as we were better than we were since the 50's and we didn't know exactly who to replace him with.

Come on guys, hurry up... a random online user has to interview a potential candidate, get the contract drawn up and signed before we can even discuss that Tony Smith time might be running out.

Moran must read this forum and think

'come on guys, ONE of you has to come up with a decent suggestion for a replacement or im NEVER going to be able to get rid'