Warrington for the lot. I can really see this happening.

Interesting observation as most Saints fans, and Wiganers I'd bet, would put our pack as our big strength.

It's between Saints, Wigan and Warrington.

Wigan I'm unsure what to expect really. Lot of spotlight on them behaviour wise after last season. That aggression is one of their main assets. I also think they're one dimensional and teams are increasingly adept at defending that set pattern they play. If the aggression is brought down a peg, their side isn't exactly packed with ability. Don't rate their halves and they are rather prone to errors in the backs. Pack has been strengthened a lot though. Their back row is still their clear strength.

Wire have a quality set of forwards but I don't think much of the backline or halves if I'm honest. I think there's an element of confusion over how to use Ratchford, your big asset in my view and I don't really see an organising half that'll keep you in games with a kicking game when your pack hasn't rolled someone easily.

Should be a good season though.

your failing observations on the depth and quality of our "backline or halves" is far worse than that Chester Wires view on Saints!

I might well be wrong. I do think our pack this year is so strong that any others seem weak in comparison. Our pack was good last year but lacked aggression on occasion. With Sims and a revived Westwood, I don't think we'll suffer with that this year.

I've just looked at your pack again and there are clearly some big hitters in there but AS A PACK, I don't really get it.

If you get the two halves and Lomax clicking (or even on the pitch together) then you'll score hatfuls of tries with the speed you have in the three quarters. Percival, Swift, Makinson may not have the glamour of Charnley or Monaghan, but boy they can move.

What's not to get? Thompson replaces Laffranchi (his stats were better than laffranchis last season and he's only going to get better), Vea replaces Manu (pretty much like for like from what I've seen) and Greenwood replaces Soliola (alright this is the riskiest one, but it's no different to Warrington replacing Waterhouse with Laithwaite) - the kids (Davies, Fleming, Savelio etc) step into the bit part roles others played last season.

Basically the same pack as last year over all that steam rollered it's way to the trophy with no halfbacks ...

steamrollered?

LLS. Wigan
CC, Warri warri..
Gf.. Saints..

You mean the pack that swerved us for a knackered Catalan?

I'd tip us for at least one trophy this season.

It's a valid claim. We had no half backs and somehow won the GF. Something must have caused that.

In the final play off's I do think you had the prefect storm. You were playing a Catalans team who in the space of 3 weeks had clocked up more Air miles than Alan Whicker & were dead on their feet. If you had played either Us or Wigan you would not have made it to O/T......... then in the first 10 minutes at O/T Ben Flower.............................

It's an interesting observation.

Saints' pack was huge for us last year; it's the sole reason we finished top and won it after losing our entire playmaking contingent.

Saints will run with Amor, Walmsley, Masoe, Richards and Savelio as traditional props with Thompson, Vea and LMS as back rowers/props and Wilkin and Greenwood as standard second rowers. Then you've still got Flanagan, Walker as back up.

Roby needs no introduction. Hohaia will spell with him this year as well allowing Roby to be fresher hopefully.

I have concerns over a couple of things but the pack is one area I definitely am not worried over.

Yes your pack helped you win some games, but it did you no favours against us.

If you'd have picked us, we'd have won and Wigan would've won the GF. So in a way, I'm glad you didn't pick us!

You sound like the wiganers in the week leading up to the grand final

You betray your inferiority complex with every post you make.

Warrington are a raindrop on our window. We're St Helens, a club that demands and expects championships and ultimately, attains them. We don't pray every year to be taken seriously; we are taken very seriously because of the reality of whom we are. A select few clubs in world sport are privy to such a position. Warrington, sadly, will never attain such prestige.

Nevertheless, you're a talented group this coming season and represent a real threat to our hopes. As such, I have chosen to discuss the coming season with you all. It'd be nice to not have to read such mundane rubbish following each post. Thankfully, at least one Warrington supporter is capable of avoiding doing so.