I've posted a fair bit this week, but have certainly had a quiet close season on here

Totally agree.

There's a select band of people on here who seem intent on ruining evrything that is good about the place.

I remember why I first joined here, because it's called 'RLFans'. I classed myself as a fan, a fan of Warrington Wolves & a fan of RL. I wanted to speak with like minded people and to share opinions and god forbid, maybe even learn something, or see a different prospective. I'm glad to say that I've actually made some friends through this forum, not just people that I agree with on a thread, genuine friends who's company I enjoy very much, and so in that respect, I'm very glad that I joined. There's also people who I've never met, but I speak with on here, and I look forward to reading their posts, a mix of wit, humour and not least some knowledgable people about rugby. We've all got a different vantage point at the game, and see things through different sets of eyes, so It makes sense we'll not always see things the same.

I'm not sure recently, that's the way folk are viewing this forum. It appears that the forum is heading in a way that people think the only way to promote debate is to criticise something or somebody and that's crap, the whole dynamic of the forum has changed, we used to have 10 page threads probably about nothing really, they just drifted, lots of people got involved, and if you like we 'shared the joke'. If you weren't involved, they might give you a wry smile in work, they did me. Every post now feels like defence & counter defence, like if your posting, your constantly battling for your corner and after a while, folk will just give up, by the looks of things, folk already have done.

Well posted and well reasoned and I agree.

I do think it is fair to say though that there was/is an underground superiority/ownership issue between those who posted on here before the exodus from Andy Topham's wolfweb and those that joined afterwards. The former posters lament the direction in which the forum has gone since, and ther latter believe that there is a clique and it is exclusive. Both attitudes cause friction which we see frequently vented. In reality no-one "owns" the forum and everybody has a right to post what they like within the bounds of the AUP.

I consider the outcome will be that this forum continues in, what I beleive to be, it's inexorable decline and a new forum will be set up for those dissatisfied with the offering and wish to recover what was lost.

Although this will be a shame, I am getting sick and tired of the sniping and back biting. What is more concerning is that we have recently had blatant personal insults made from posters I respect who are being dragged down at equal rate with the forum content.

You see, without getting too nostalgic, but your one of the people that I'm on about really. We used to have a pop at each other, but in between would share a PM that would acknowledge a witty retort or such. We've had page after page threads about you, poking fun at your life, putting iu up against mine, 'How the other half live' sort of jest. The thread would roll along, and you'd know in your head certain folk from here would join in, it'd rattle along, and if you went offline for an hour or two, it was two pages longer when you came back, it gave you a good laugh, folk had taken the thread along, and you'd rejoin and enjoy it kinda thing. That wouldn't get past a page now without folk saying 'LOCK IT' and putting the MOD's in a position.

For me that's what this forum was about, when there was an RL point to be debated, lets debate it, 30 pages of it, great. When there's a lull, Tuesday or Wednesday like, have a bit of fun, otherwise the same stuff just comes up. If you look at the thread, and it's not for you, come off it. Some stuff bores me senseless on here, but I'll just click 'Back' and try and find another thread that I think I can add something too.

There used to be a friendlyness to the banter, if you had gone too far, an apology was always around the corner & I think the poster felt a tad upset, even though in jest they'd gone a little far. I did it once or twice I know, and apologised, but I think both parties kinda took it at face value (over the net ??), and no harm was intended etc. Right now, it feels a little bit aggresive, and I think this stems back to what I said, that every thread, you always feel that your on the backfoot from the off.

Again, I agree with yourself and JWP.

You and myself have disagreed numerous times in the past, but at least when we have we have both given the reasons why we disagree. If you say why you think X is crap, you explain why and I might explain why I think he's not.

Lately, we are getting posters who offer no debate whatsoever. They are limited to one line where they say player x is good/bad but don't say why.

This forum has lost debate.

And I know, someone wil come on here and say it's up to us to get it back to where it was, but to be perfectly honest, I can't be bothered trawling through the diatribe to find someone who actually wants to debate with me and I'm presuming that goes for others.

Now I'm not wanting to step on anyones toes, and just like a ref, it's a job I wouldn't want to do on here, but I think the mods have to have a tighter rein on things. I'm a mod on another forum and I understand it's hard knowing where to draw the line, but I think if we could at least get rid of the incessant trolls and spamming with stupid threads, that would be a start.

Other forums have the ability to stop this with "No New topics", where you can ban any particular poster from starting a thread, so if we have the likes of Casual Des or one of his cohorts etc, stick that against their name and they can't start a new topic unless this is removed. Let them earn the right to start new threads. This would stop the incessant spamming of stupid new topics by the same old people. Just things like that would be a step. I know it may have things to do with the software used on the forum, but it needs to improve before I consider making the effort again.

You are dead right and I miss the cutting comments and witty remarks. We had running jokes which gave endless opportunity for teasing. It seems now there is a genuine antipathy which I fear would even result in confrontation if those in conflict actually, heaven forbid, bumped into each other.

Just to add to what I said previously, I see there has been a thread by the mods, which I congratulate them on, just hope it works.

All fair points Keithcun.

My only issue is that of tighter, draconian, moderation. I know they do a difficult job and I often complain (if only to play up my liberal anarchist alter-ego thing I have going) when I believe I see subjective decision making. There is a valid argument against any moderation process (usually expressed as "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes" (who watches the watchers). I would be much more content if the moderators were appointed democratically by the the forum members on merit rather than "act of god" appointments as we see now. This would create a positive environment which both builds trust and faith in the moderation process and applies a subtle back pressure to moderators that in essence there are answerable to the membership in general.

Having said that I believe that the "new invite only" specialist forum may be the only answer to create the environment of quality, reasoned debate.

As a follow on from what has just been said about debate with humour etc.

Im all for debate with reasoned argument with a bit of mickey taking thrown in.

What I detest is when posters start getting on your back and calling you names just because you have a differing view.

I had a good and fair debate with Chick this morning about the merits of expansion, we both put our views across and in the end agreed to disagree without the hint of any back biting or name calling.

Its a shame that others cant do the same.

Speaking personally, I feel that im an easy target and regularly feel like a fox that is being hunted down by a pack of bloodthirsty hounds.

I am now taking the stance of ignoring any comments made to provoke a reaction and will post within the rules set down in the AUP.

I hope that I will be supported and protected by my fellow posters and the mods alike.

Got it in one.

I hadn't agreed to that bit yet

[emmerdale mode] Not bin t' same since Neil & Nat sold up [/end mode].

But in seriousness Wolfweb was like this too. Especially when people were frustrated & we were doing crap. Anyone with a long memory will remember I went through a stage where I was constantly threatened (once in front of my kids) by a forum bully. The result of that was the formation of the meessageboard team that played v opposition fans befopre a game & got ratted straight afterwards. so Happy Ending.

Best thing to do was to ignore it, starve them of attention & they go away.

Thats the answer to all the problems on here.

The team starts performing and winning, people start being more positive and less argumentative.

Its frustration boiling over.

In the past one of the first things i would do when i got in would be to check this forum to see what was going on, not anymore as people have said its gone down hill and has become petty and childish......and its always the same people.

Ok then, many seem to agree. So, instead of relying on the moderators to clean up the forum (in reality, we don't actually intervene much at all, despite several criticisms lately), let's all as posters re-claim the forum for proper debate and interesting, amusing banter.