FORUMS FORUMS



  
FORUMS > Salford Red Devils > Salary Cap breach
145 posts in 11 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, king of the shed
RankPostsTeam
Club Coach133No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 200420 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Aug 2017Aug 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



With all this talk that MK said publicly he would break the salary cap ,I don't ever recall him saying those words.I do remember him saying the cap was too low and he would like to pay his players more. Does anyone remember or have a link?

RankPostsTeam
International Star1583No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201311 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2024Oct 2023LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: DEVILS2015 "A lot of promises that were made to him when he took over the club.

Not many people know this but the RFL have taken away £50,000 funding per year away from our academy for the next 4 YEARS

Excessive fines just because he's got a few quid. Fielding 14 players fined £15,000 Saints did the same and got fined jack $h1t!

The ridiculous points deduction whats about to take place even though Wigan, Warrington, Catalan and Leeds are all miles over the cap too, or have been in the past but it's been simply swept under the carpet.

Honestly who the hell would even bother putting the money in it must drive you insane with these ar$e holes at Red Hall running the show.'"


What promises were made? Which ones have not been kept?

Do other clubs get funding for their academy? Is it the same for every club? Why was the funding taken away?

How do you know there will be a ridiculous points deduction? How many points would have to be deducted for it to be ridiculous? Are you the arbiter?

Other clubs may be paying over the cap. You should give your evidence to the RFL.

I presume that the number of points will depend on the severity of the offence. It appears that as at least one player, Tony Puletua, had two contracts one of which was concealed until his tribunal. There would appear to have been some concealment of facts from the RFL. If this apparent dishonest practice is proved I would expect any punishment to be quite severe. I am not aware that such dishonesty has been proved to have occurred in other instances of cap breaking so comparisons of punishment with previous examples of cap breaking would seem to be pointless.

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach2833No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Apr 200916 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Apr 2022Apr 2022LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: oldhamred "With all this talk that MK said publicly he would break the salary cap ,I don't ever recall him saying those words.I do remember him saying the cap was too low and he would like to pay his players more. Does anyone remember or have a link?'"


www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-lea ... an-1876981

www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... lford.html
Quote: oldhamred "With all this talk that MK said publicly he would break the salary cap ,I don't ever recall him saying those words.I do remember him saying the cap was too low and he would like to pay his players more. Does anyone remember or have a link?'"


www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-lea ... an-1876981

www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... lford.html


RankPostsTeam
Club Coach133No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 200420 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Aug 2017Aug 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



oldhamred wrote:
With all this talk that MK said publicly he would break the salary cap ,I don't ever recall him saying those words.I do remember him saying the cap was too low and he would like to pay his players more. Does anyone remember or have a link?


www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-lea ... an-1876981

www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... lford.html

Fair enough . ...Then again, could it actually be proved he said these things. We all know what journalists are like..
oldhamred wrote:
With all this talk that MK said publicly he would break the salary cap ,I don't ever recall him saying those words.I do remember him saying the cap was too low and he would like to pay his players more. Does anyone remember or have a link?


www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-lea ... an-1876981

www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... lford.html

Fair enough . ...Then again, could it actually be proved he said these things. We all know what journalists are like..


RankPostsTeam
Player Coach2833No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Apr 200916 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Apr 2022Apr 2022LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: oldhamred "oldhamred wrote:
With all this talk that MK said publicly he would break the salary cap ,I don't ever recall him saying those words.I do remember him saying the cap was too low and he would like to pay his players more. Does anyone remember or have a link?



Owing to the fact Koukash was going to sue Locke, Hock, Puletua, Salford City Council and Leigh I would imagine he would have taken some kind of action if these nationally published direct quotes were inaccurate ( or at least threatened to do so).

RankPostsTeam
Club Owner5594
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 200321 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2023Aug 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



I think seeing our Cas friends return to these boards, bodes well for the outcome of this particular incident.

icon_smile.gif

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach2833No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Apr 200916 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Apr 2022Apr 2022LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: TheButcher "I think seeing our Cas friends return to these boards, bodes well for the outcome of this particular incident.


If only everyone thought my presence bided well for success I would be a rich man.....

RankPostsTeam
International Star2666No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Mar 201312 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
May 2017Nov 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



I don't get the 10 page issue. We've broken the cap, it's in black and white and we have to face the consequences. Ultimately it is Marwan Koukash's fault, just as he should be praised for appointing Tim Sheens he should be criticised for breaking operational rules.

We deserve to be punished accordingly and hopefully any such deductions will be similar to those who have done the same before us.

As others have echoed, you could stomach it if we'd been reasonably successful but to break the cap on that bunch of sh*t was a waste.

RankPostsTeam
International Star1583No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201311 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2024Oct 2023LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: John Gilbert Reds "I don't get the 10 page issue. We've broken the cap, it's in black and white and we have to face the consequences. Ultimately it is Marwan Koukash's fault, just as he should be praised for appointing Tim Sheens he should be criticised for breaking operational rules.

We deserve to be punished accordingly and hopefully any such deductions will be similar to those who have done the same before us.

As others have echoed, you could stomach it if we'd been reasonably successful but to break the cap on that bunch of sh*t was a waste.'"


Has it been proved that other clubs have been guilty of breaking the cap in the same way that it seems Salford has done? Surely giving at least one player two contracts only one of which appears to have been declared to the RFL is a very serious offence and any punishment should reflect this. Breaches by other clubs cannot be compared without knowing the details of the breaches. Any deductions should only be similar to those who have done the same before you if the offence was similar.

RankPostsTeam
Club Coach10390No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jan 200520 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Feb 2018Sep 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



I agree, take the punishment.

But what I would do if I were the Doc is name names if he has evidence of other clubs doing this.

RankPostsTeam
International Star578
JoinedServiceReputation
Jan 201312 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2016Nov 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Michigan red "I agree, take the punishment.

But what I would do if I were the Doc is name names if he has evidence of other clubs doing this.'"


Totally agree. MK needs to throw other clubs under the bus. It might delay the outcome of the investigation, but if other clubs are also docked points it could really help us out.

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach15521
JoinedServiceReputation
Mar 201015 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
May 2020May 2020LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: bandgeekmafia78 "Totally agree. MK needs to throw other clubs under the bus. It might delay the outcome of the investigation, but if other clubs are also docked points it could really help us out.'"


I agree with the sentiment, but not the justification; if the cap is routinely being broken (which I strongly suspect is the case) by similar means to those allegedly employed by Salford, and Mr Koukash has evidence of that, he should inform the RFL. It could be argued that he should have done so at the time he made those comments, as it's never a good look when someone blows the whistle on others for historical breaches of a rule they've just been caught breaking themselves, but either way - if clubs are playing fast and loose with the SC, it should be busted wide open - for the sake of fairness though, rather than to delay the Salford case.

RankPostsTeam
International Star2666No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Mar 201312 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
May 2017Nov 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



I don’t think how the cap has been broken matters, but how much it was broken by. I can only assume previous punishments reflects how much over the cap those clubs were. Following the Tony Puletua tribunal, it became public knowledge that only £80k of TP’s £120k annual salary was on the cap with the additional £40k made up through a separate payment via Marwan Koukash’s EuroMachTech company.

It’s worth acknowledging that whilst this payment was made in 2014, it wasn’t made in 2015 (Tony Puletua didn’t play for Salford that year) which was the root cause of the tribunal. Therefore have we broken the cap in 2015, if payment wasnt made? I guess that is up to MK’s legal experts to prove/disprove.

In summary, best case is we’ve cheated the cap by £40k, worst case is £80k (depending how 2015 is viewed). That doesn’t seem like much.

With regards to other clubs breaking the cap and Koukash “throwing them under the bus” he would have to have some pretty hard evidence to prove it, otherwise he could be on the end of a number of libel claims.

RankPostsTeam
International Star1583No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201311 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2024Oct 2023LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: John Gilbert Reds "I don’t think how the cap has been broken matters, but how much it was broken by. I can only assume previous punishments reflects how much over the cap those clubs were. Following the Tony Puletua tribunal, it became public knowledge that only £80k of TP’s £120k annual salary was on the cap with the additional £40k made up through a separate payment via Marwan Koukash’s EuroMachTech company.

It’s worth acknowledging that whilst this payment was made in 2014, it wasn’t made in 2015 (Tony Puletua didn’t play for Salford that year) which was the root cause of the tribunal. Therefore have we broken the cap in 2015, if payment wasnt made? I guess that is up to MK’s legal experts to prove/disprove.

In summary, best case is we’ve cheated the cap by £40k, worst case is £80k (depending how 2015 is viewed). That doesn’t seem like much.

With regards to other clubs breaking the cap and Koukash “throwing them under the bus” he would have to have some pretty hard evidence to prove it, otherwise he could be on the end of a number of libel claims.'"


How do you know it was not paid in 2015? Salford were still paying part of his disclosed salary, Dr K publicly said this, even when he was playing at HKR. In view of the high profile signings made by Salford do you think Tony P would be the only one on two contracts?

RankPostsTeam
International Star1300No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jan 201213 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Mar 2018Mar 2018LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: John Gilbert Reds "I don’t think how the cap has been broken matters, but how much it was broken by. I can only assume previous punishments reflects how much over the cap those clubs were. Following the Tony Puletua tribunal, it became public knowledge that only £80k of TP’s £120k annual salary was on the cap with the additional £40k made up through a separate payment via Marwan Koukash’s EuroMachTech company.

It’s worth acknowledging that whilst this payment was made in 2014, it wasn’t made in 2015 (Tony Puletua didn’t play for Salford that year) which was the root cause of the tribunal. Therefore have we broken the cap in 2015, if payment wasnt made? I guess that is up to MK’s legal experts to prove/disprove.

In summary, best case is we’ve cheated the cap by £40k, worst case is £80k (depending how 2015 is viewed). That doesn’t seem like much.

With regards to other clubs breaking the cap and Koukash “throwing them under the bus” he would have to have some pretty hard evidence to prove it, otherwise he could be on the end of a number of libel claims.'"


I think there have been significant changes in RFL salary cap rules. This was in part due to earlier punishments being seen as derisory. Now the punishments are more significant and the RFL board have greater discretion re the way they deal with clubs. The way the cap is now monitored leaves less wriggle room for 'oversights and honest mistakes'.

It is conjecture but it is possible that other players have been paid via Euromatech or other companies. If so these payments may not be relevant for an Employment Tribunal but highly relevant re salary cap considerations. Furthermore there are likely to be rules about the disclosure of player payments - even if the salary cap was not being breached.

Until the charges are made public - they may never be?- we do not know if they relate to one or many players and whether they extend beyond the salary cap.

I am pretty sure Dr K and the club will have a rigorous defence and their record to date on player related matters suggests the result of the current case is not a 'done deal'.

145 posts in 11 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, king of the shed
145 posts in 11 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, king of the shed



All views expressed are those of the author and not necessarily those of the RLFANS.COM or its subsites.

Whilst every effort is made to ensure that news stories, articles and images are correct, we cannot be held responsible for errors. However, if you feel any material on this website is copyrighted or incorrect in any way please contact us using the link at the top of the page so we can remove it or negotiate copyright permission.

RLFANS.COM, the owners of this website, is not responsible for the content of its sub-sites or posts, please email the author of this sub-site or post if you feel you find an article offensive or of a choice nature that you disagree with.

Copyright 1999 - 2024 RLFANS.COM

You must be 18+ to gamble, for more information and for help with gambling issues see https://www.begambleaware.org/.



Please Support RLFANS.COM


9.42626953125:10
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
7m
2025 Recruitment
paulwalker71
205
8m
Salford placed in special measures
poplar cats
111
15m
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Hullrealist
4047
16m
Film game
karetaker
5751
24m
Pre Season - 2025
Hullrealist
191
27m
How many games will we win
Shifty Cat
40
46m
Ground Improvements
Khlav Kalash
192
47m
Rumours and signings v9
apollosghost
28901
Recent
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40800
Recent
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
48s
Ground Improvements
Khlav Kalash
192
1m
Salford
Wires71
53
1m
Spirit of the Rhinos
batleyrhino
5
1m
Planning for next season
Bent&Bon
184
1m
Pre Season - 2025
Hullrealist
191
2m
Castleford sack Lingard
Another Cas
16
2m
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
3m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
chapylad
2607
3m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
63266
4m
New Kit
matt_wire
69
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
2025 Fixtures
Jemmo
1
TODAY
2025 Squad
Sadfish
1
TODAY
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
TODAY
Fixtures 2025
paulwalker71
8
TODAY
Spirit of the Rhinos
batleyrhino
5
TODAY
Mike Ogunwole
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Bailey Dawson
Wanderer
1
TODAY
2024
REDWHITEANDB
14
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
Shifty Cat
40
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
Bent&Bon
6
TODAY
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
6
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
Wires71
53
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
POSTSONLINEREGISTRATIONSRECORD
19.65M 1,802 ↓-11880,15614,103
LOGIN HERE
or REGISTER for more features!.

When you register you get access to the live match scores, live match chat and you can post in the discussions on the forums.
RLFANS Match Centre
 Thu 13th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Wigan
v
Leigh
 Fri 14th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Hull KR
v
Castleford
20:00
Catalans
v
Hull FC
 Sat 15th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Leeds
v
Wakefield
17:30
St.Helens
v
Salford
 Sun 16th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Warrington
 Thu 20th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Wakefield
v
Hull KR
 Fri 21st Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Warrington
v
Catalans
20:00
Hull FC
v
Wigan
 Sat 22nd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
15:00
Salford
v
Leeds
20:00
Castleford
v
St.Helens
 Sun 23rd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
14:30
Leigh
v
Huddersfield
 Sun 2nd Mar 2025
     National Rugby League 2024-R1
04:30
Penrith
v
Cronulla
06:30
Canberra
v
NZ Warriors
 Thu 6th Mar 2025
     National Rugby League 2024-R1
09:00
Sydney
v
Brisbane
     Mens Super League XXX-R3
20:00
Hull FC
v
Leigh
 Fri 7th Mar 2025
     National Rugby League 2024-R1
07:00
Wests
v
Newcastle
09:00
Dolphins
v
Souths
     Mens Super League XXX-R3
20:00
Castleford
v
Salford
20:00
St.Helens
v
Hull KR
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds-Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield-Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Hull KR
Sat 8th Mar
SL
17:30
Catalans-Leeds
Sun 9th Mar
SL
17:30
Warrington-Wakefield
SL
17:30
Wigan-Huddersfield
Thu 20th Mar
SL
20:00
Salford-Huddersfield
Fri 21st Mar
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Warrington
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
7m
2025 Recruitment
paulwalker71
205
8m
Salford placed in special measures
poplar cats
111
15m
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Hullrealist
4047
16m
Film game
karetaker
5751
24m
Pre Season - 2025
Hullrealist
191
27m
How many games will we win
Shifty Cat
40
46m
Ground Improvements
Khlav Kalash
192
47m
Rumours and signings v9
apollosghost
28901
Recent
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40800
Recent
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
48s
Ground Improvements
Khlav Kalash
192
1m
Salford
Wires71
53
1m
Spirit of the Rhinos
batleyrhino
5
1m
Planning for next season
Bent&Bon
184
1m
Pre Season - 2025
Hullrealist
191
2m
Castleford sack Lingard
Another Cas
16
2m
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
3m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
chapylad
2607
3m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
63266
4m
New Kit
matt_wire
69
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
2025 Fixtures
Jemmo
1
TODAY
2025 Squad
Sadfish
1
TODAY
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
TODAY
Fixtures 2025
paulwalker71
8
TODAY
Spirit of the Rhinos
batleyrhino
5
TODAY
Mike Ogunwole
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Bailey Dawson
Wanderer
1
TODAY
2024
REDWHITEANDB
14
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
Shifty Cat
40
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
Bent&Bon
6
TODAY
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
6
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
Wires71
53
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!