FORUMS > Salford Red Devils > Time for change |
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| I think British rugby league's in a very stale phase of it's history and it's falling further behind other sports every single year. Long gone are the days of the elite NRL players and union international superstars helping to attract more followers to our sport. To further compound the problems we are losing quality players and it’s only going to get worse as the gulf in salary cap increases. Personally I think RL was substantially more entertaining to watch 2-3 decades ago than it is today. The future going forward is bleak and potentially irreversible and I expect the fall in entertainment levels and interest to be reflected in Sky's next TV deal. The British game needs a massive shot in the arm to revive it but it’s just never going to happen unless the financial shackles placed on clubs are relaxed.
The current system may financially suit some benefactors but it's flawed and it's just making our sport less saleable and less attractive to watch year after year. The sport needs visionaries and speculative investors but we aren’t going to attract them with limiting, narrow minded operating conditions. The problem I see is the decision makers in our sport (club owners) don’t want to or can't invest new money and they’re concerned someone that does could enjoy some success and take their place at the top table. The salary cap may suit many club owners but it’s not the level playing field some say it is. For instance some big and historically successful clubs have a long tradition of attracting local quality kids due to their proximity to some of the best local amateur clubs.
I’ll ask you to consider a question. Do you think Sky would have offered the deal they did back in 1996 had Wigan not put Rugby League back on the map between the 80’s and 90’s with such a huge investment in the sport? And could they have achieved this if they were constrained with a salary cap? If our sport is ever going to expand and improve then surely people need to get their heads out of the sand and stop only thinking about there own circumstances.
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| Fan with rich owner in 'scrap the cap' shocker!
The salary cap ensures that clubs don't go to the wall trying to keep up with those trying to buy success. Without it, Salford (like many other clubs) would have ceased to exist long ago.
The question of whether the cap should be raised is a different matter. But scrapping it altogether would likely lead to some clubs booming, but most going bust.
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| Quote: theredshed "I think British rugby league's in a very stale phase of it's history and it's falling further behind other sports every single year. Long gone are the days of the elite NRL players and union international superstars helping to attract more followers to our sport. To further compound the problems we are losing quality players and it’s only going to get worse as the gulf in salary cap increases. Personally I think RL was substantially more entertaining to watch 2-3 decades ago than it is today. The future going forward is bleak and potentially irreversible and I expect the fall in entertainment levels and interest to be reflected in Sky's next TV deal. The British game needs a massive shot in the arm to revive it but it’s just never going to happen unless the financial shackles placed on clubs are relaxed.
The current system may financially suit some benefactors but it's flawed and it's just making our sport less saleable and less attractive to watch year after year. The sport needs visionaries and speculative investors but we aren’t going to attract them with limiting, narrow minded operating conditions. The problem I see is the decision makers in our sport (club owners) don’t want to or can't invest new money and they’re concerned someone that does could enjoy some success and take their place at the top table. The salary cap may suit many club owners but it’s not the level playing field some say it is. For instance some big and historically successful clubs have a long tradition of attracting local quality kids due to their proximity to some of the best local amateur clubs.
I’ll ask you to consider a question. Do you think Sky would have offered the deal they did back in 1996 had Wigan not put Rugby League back on the map between the 80’s and 90’s with such a huge investment in the sport? And could they have achieved this if they were constrained with a salary cap? If our sport is ever going to expand and improve then surely people need to get their heads out of the sand and stop only thinking about there own circumstances.'"
Hello Marwan!!
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| I'm not a fan anymore and I haven't attended a game this year due to being totally disallusioned with the sport. Sadly the game is dying a slow death in it's present format. Just because there's no cap wouldn't mean clubs would go bust. It's a total myth used often as a counter argument for scraping the cap. History proves that clubs survived 100 plus years before the cap. The main reason for the cap is for owners to remain owners year after year without having to dip their hand further in their pockets. All this achieves is preventing new money being invested in the sport.
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| Quote: theredshed "I'm not a fan anymore and I haven't attended a game this year due to being totally disallusioned with the sport. Sadly the game is dying a slow death in it's present format. Just because there's no cap wouldn't mean clubs would go bust. It's a total myth used often as a counter argument for scraping the cap. History proves that clubs survived 100 plus years before the cap. The main reason for the cap is for owners to remain owners without having to dip their hand further in their pockets. All this achieves is preventing new money being invested in the sport.'"
Even if clubs didn't go bust, it would mean some teams can buy their way to success, constantly stealing the best players from other clubs and leaving them with less support, therefore less money, therefore even less chance of competing.
Essentially, because you have a rich owner you expect to buy success. Maybe football could fill the gap you have now you are no longer watching RL?
Having said that, I do think the cap needs raising.
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| Quote: nottinghamtiger "Even if clubs didn't go bust, it would mean some teams can buy their way to success, constantly stealing the best players from other clubs and leaving them with less support, therefore less money, therefore even less chance of competing.
Essentially, because you have a rich owner you expect to buy success. Maybe football could fill the gap you have now you are no longer watching RL?
Having said that, I do think the cap needs raising.'"
I've watched this sport for years and it's always a small pool of clubs that have most of the success. This is mainly down to a long tradition of bigger support and their strong links with better quality local amateur clubs. What was wrong with a Man City or a Chelsea investing big money and enjoying/sustaining a share of the glory? In my view it's helped take football in England & Wales to a whole new level as the huge increase in Sky money shows.
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| Quote: theredshed "I've watched this sport for years and it's always a small pool of clubs that have most of the success. This is mainly down to a long tradition of bigger support and their strong links with better quality local amateur clubs. What was wrong with a Man City or a Chelsea investing big money and enjoying/sustaining a share of the glory? In my view it's helped take football in England & Wales to a whole new level as the huge increase in Sky money shows.'"
Yes, I thought the same when I watched the England national team. Or all the club teams get knocked out of Europe even though they are seeded in groups and should really make the quarter finals.
I think we are just about to see some further clubs gain success in RL. Hull FC and Warrington look set for a good tilt at becoming champions. In the past two years Hull KR and Cas have been in the cup final. I agree that we now need trophies to be spread more evenly, however scrapping the salary cap would surely mean an even smaller pool of clubs having the chance of success?
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| Just remind me what decade did GB/England last win a test series against Australia? The difference is regardless of England's continual failure since 66 and our clubs lack of success in Europe over the past few seasons football is still thriving financially.
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| Quote: theredshed "Just remind me what decade did GB/England last win a test series against Australia? The difference is regardless of England's continual failure since 66 and our clubs lack of success in Europe over the past few seasons football is still thriving financially.'"
Indeed. Football is thriving, but how many of the clubs are? Most are run at a massive loss and are always on the edge of collapse should a rich owner decide to walk away.
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| "Most are run at a massive loss and are always on the edge of collapse should a rich owner decide to walk away."
but they don't.
Let's ignore football as it is so embedded into the national way of thinking that no sport can compete .
RedShed does have a point: I do worry about this game. It needs people at the ground to provide income and atmosphere but going to a sports match (bar football) is in decline. The game is becoming slow (largely down to not policing tackles IMO). We do not have the status of |RU. At least we are not as badly off as cricket (bar T20).
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| I agree that rugby league has always and will always be a million miles behind football. The closest the sport came to football was probably around the 1930’s but over the past decade rugby league hasn’t progressed whilst football has grown at an epic pace.
The point I was making about Wigan from around the early 1980’s was how a few wealthy individuals helped transform a sport that was in decline. Wigan signed world class players from the NRL and union that put bums on seats home and away and raised the bar. The problem is If the bar isn’t being raised clubs then function within their financial comfort zone and the sport becomes more predictable and stagnant. If clubs (like at present) can operate at full cap with their existing income levels there becomes less need/urgency to go out and find new money/investors or market themselves and the sport much better. I just feel the game is crying out for a shake up because standing still with no new money coming into the game isn't going to promote growth.
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| It's a BIG question , & 1 with so many permutations .
both on a local - national level .
I don't think the sport is stale ,
maybe after 40 odd years of watching it , it's just me .
Issue is attracting new support & young fans , in a world when 6 yr old kids have smart phones ..
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| Quote: nottinghamtiger "Fan with rich owner in 'scrap the cap' shocker!
The salary cap ensures that clubs don't go to the wall trying to keep up with those trying to buy success. Without it, Salford (like many other clubs) would have ceased to exist long ago.
The question of whether the cap should be raised is a different matter. But scrapping it altogether would likely lead to some clubs booming, but most going bust.'"
I don't disagree with your comments, however the cap should have been raised long before now, what was good for the game 20 years ago does not apply now, look how other sports have excelled, not one with restricted practices.
I also used to religiously attend the challenge cup final up to 2 years ago, this prestige competition is losing the neutral fan year on year, the rugby league can continue to massage the corporate seats as sold when the actual crowds are nearer 60,000 than the 100,000 of yesteryear.
Now I am not a fan of MK & the ongoing dispute is having such a negative effect on the club & its fans, season ticket holders are disillusioned & are no longer attending match, I have personally given up try to attract the casual fan.
Clearly MK was sold a lemon & promised the earth & looking from his prospective, if the only income he receives is the revenue from gate receipts & merchandise then the only way he can maybe grow the club is only by attracting a better package on the field, failure to do this will only leave him putting his hand in pocket season after season to prop up another failing club, surely this is not good for the game.
Finally the issue around the cap for me only goes to show how weak our sport is, clearly very few clubs can stand on there own two feet, not really a good endorsement!
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| Wigan didn't invest in the sport. They didn't even invest in Wigan. They just spent money they didn't have. Anyone can do that. And it nearly killed the sport.
The reason the sport is in the state it is now is because of the hugely short-sighted, short term decisions made in the 70's, 80's and early 90's.
Nobody invested in club facilities or infrastructure and nobody invested in the sport infrastructure. So when changes in society and the media happened we were left massively behind.
We don't need to spend on players. We aren't going to get the likes of Cameron Smith over here, it's not going to happen. It doesn't matter how much we pay because they want to play SOO.
The union players either aren't up to it or are the wrong type of player for League.
Instead of spending, we need to invest. In our sport, in our club infrastructure, in our marketing, in our community engagement and in our amateur game.
That is what will bring people through the doors, not spending millions of pounds we don't have for 10 years until we all go bust again.
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| Quote: Him "Wigan didn't invest in the sport. They didn't even invest in Wigan. They just spent money they didn't have. Anyone can do that. And it nearly killed the sport.
The reason the sport is in the state it is now is because of the hugely short-sighted, short term decisions made in the 70's, 80's and early 90's.
Nobody invested in club facilities or infrastructure and nobody invested in the sport infrastructure. So when changes in society and the media happened we were left massively behind.
We don't need to spend on players. We aren't going to get the likes of Cameron Smith over here, it's not going to happen. It doesn't matter how much we pay because they want to play SOO.
The union players either aren't up to it or are the wrong type of player for League.
Instead of spending, we need to invest. In our sport, in our club infrastructure, in our marketing, in our community engagement and in our amateur game.
That is what will bring people through the doors, not spending millions of pounds we don't have for 10 years until we all go bust again.'"
Don't disagree with anything you have written but do you really think the present system is working! as a life long supporter who follows not only my local club but attends internationals, challenge cup finals, premiership finals really cannot be d anymore, unfortunately I am not alone, this does not look like a sport on the way up but going down.
I maybe in the minority but what is the Canadian project all about! for me we should be putting this money into the grassroots of our game. When I was in school in Salford in the 60s we played rugby in every school in Salford, your lucky if a school plays rugby! The rugby league have announced big profits, try putting it back into the development of the game.
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