I know... but it does show how stats don't tell the full story, the hysteria behind the Fielden thread was ridiculous but he is still some distance away from the England squad despite being the first English forward in the tackle bust list (if you don't count Manu!)

I hope our young players are not realists too!

The only reason you have named those two players and think that they are better than the likes of Eastmond is because they are Australian. You are a dope and need to get a grip.

Barba and Hodkinson are Playing really well in the NRL, something I doubt, having seen a lot of Tomkins, Eastmond, Myler, and Brown, could do.
As for comparing them because they're Australian, I thought that was what this topic was about? Being good enough to beat the Aussies? Which we aren't, and comparing our younger players to theirs won't be for a while yet.
The dope comment just helps my argument to be honest, you can't see the bigger picture.
I've never doubted that our young backs, Tomkins and Eastmond especially, will progress our team. But if you think that they're good enough to worry anything the Aussies have now or likely to have for at least 5-10 years then you're more stupid than your post first suggests.

Although you seem to have misread/misunderstood my post, it's pretty sad that you and other fans view the pinnacle of international RL as 'beating the Aussies'. Quite frankly I couldn't care less if England beat the Aussies or not.

The only reason you think Ben Barba and Trent Hodkinson are world beaters and better than the likes of Tomkins and Myler is because they play in the NRL. If Myler or Tomkins were Australian, you would be creaming your pants over them. It's an absolutely pathetic mentality.

I think a much bigger problem for the England set up then the amount of overseas players playing here is just how over hyped our players are simply becuase they are English, until we realise and accept there is something wrong with the way players are trained at an early age rather then blame it on overseas players nothing will change, to say Westwood and J Tomkins are better players then Manu is a joke, all three offer very different qualities, had he actually been English he would have been an excellent addition to the squad, but have to agree with the sentiments of many about his age and that he isnt really English, it shouldnt have happened.

You don't think that (consistently) beating the most dominant team in international RL is a useful yardstick?

If he's calling up anyone then he should get on the phone to Pat Richards and ask him,

Here's another stat for you then;

J.Tomkins
Errors - 22
Penalties - 27

Those tackle bust stats show that Manu offers something different to our other 2nd Row options and why, IMO, he is a better option coming off the bench then the other candidates for the position. Nobody claimed it was an indicater of how good a player he is.

LOL,

Henry Paul and Les Vainakolo have represented England and NZ. Irrespective of which sport it is, they have represented another country.

There are a whole host of footballers who have played for more than one country. Going back a few years wasn't it Alberto Di Stefano who played for Brazil, Spain and Portugal?

I think John Fashanu played for England and Nigeria.

yeah...IN DIFFERENT BLOODY SPORTS!



yeah...50 years ago..



never played for nigeria on account that he's got 2 caps for england...

Di Stefano played for Argentina, Colombia (although I think there is a debate about whether those games were FIFA sanctioned) and Spain. Ladislao Kubala played for Czechoslovakia, Hungary and Spain. As I mentioned on the Hull board 3 of Italy's 1934 FIFA World Cup winning team were Argentines who had previously played for Argentina and two of them later reverted to the land of their birth.

The thing about Di Stefano and Kubala is that they were brilliant. Along with Ferenc Puskas (85 caps for Hungary, 4 for Spain), they were they were the very best of their era.
Willie Manu is pretty good, towards the front of the peloton behind incumbents Ellis, Burgess and Westwood. He is a different type of player, perhaps picked to fill a particular niche. But then, why not Lauitiiti? It just seems to be inviting ridicule/controversy for the sake of it. It's not like the bookies will be rushing to shorten England's odds for the 4 nations or that we're suddenly thinking 'this year, just maybe...'
If he was 25, it'd be different but at 30 he won't have much improvement in him.

Chris Riley is English and the SL leading try scorer. Just wondered why he hasn't been selected at least for the squad.

From a Warrington perspective, Paul Wood has been comfortably better than Carvell this season and also has a great offloading game (more offloads this season than Solomona). Another odd choice.

Also confused about the absence of Joel Tomkins, he would make a great mongrel dog back row partner to Westwood .

Neither of which will get in ahead of Ellis and Burgess anyway.

I said on the Fielden thread that I didn't think Carvell has had that great a season. Wood would definately be ahead of him in the pecking order imo. He's been great, im not sure about GB class though