Ok I wrote this on my Facebook page after a few sneering comments and I stand by it


I guess my biggest fear is i'm a cynic, i don't trust politicians, the examples of deceit are too wide spread and far too common for my liking so i like the fact they have to be at least seen to be representing us and the fear of them being removed is something i need to feel i have.

I'm not a bat crazy fully commited little englander BREXITer, i'd prefer to be in Europe but not in this system, i think this system is corrupt or at least extremely easy to corrupt. The examples of wastage, and unnecessary bureacracy are something that grinds with me.

We are the 5th biggest players in the world, the 2nd biggest player in the union and ideally i would prefer to be IN, in a complete root and branch reforming of the the whole system.

But my options were IN or OUT, and based on such simplicity i can only see being out as a safer option.
I'm not interested if my house value goes down, my wages go down, i have less to go on holiday with, finance is a small sacrifice, a far smaller sacrifice than those who have lost their lives, from the English Civil war, to the Peterloo Massacre to the Pankhurst Womans Sufferagette movement and all those that fought wars to retain that right for democracy.

The fact that Tony Benn, a left winger, one that was held up by so many Che Guevara t-shirt wearers saw the European system for what it was, a deeply principled man no doubt, wanted no part of this, of this horribly undemocratic system and it speaks volumes to me.

I am not a right winger, i am not a little Englander and believe it or not i love many many benefits and laws the EU has brought, i see the benefits and the positives daily.
But

To have unelected people, unaccountable people, arrogant people have so much power rankles with me.
Right now the political discourse is palatable but...(a huge but) what if the winds of change start to circle?
Austria almost voted for a rightwing government, the first since WW2, that is dangerous, and if you give the masses no voice or no pathways to change you run the risk of revolt, no, in fact you make revolt inevitable.

Brexit was popular because of the arrogance of people who think they don't need a mandate from the people, missing the entire point of democracy.

I'm sorry that I'm in the same camp as racists and xenophobia, there is nothing i can about that but let me tell you i have nothing in common with those people other than an X In a box.

Money isn't everything for me, now people, let's rally together and work this out as one, we are a nation of great minds and innovators, let's continue to be so, and accept this decision with dignity.

Now for our next fight.. proportional representation.

Long live democracy

1. He's not an expert. He's the man who owns a polling company, campaigned for Leave and is extremely right-wing. Most reports on voter demographics are from his survey of 12,000 voters after the event. That's a huge sample promising reasonable accuracy. His agenda was Leave, so why you think he'd have an interest in falsely misrepresenting the data, I have no idea.

2. I've never said most out voters are rabid UKIP members.

3. I have no choice but to accept it, because I'm tied in the back of the truck as the Leave campaign drives it off the cliff, along with every other Remain voter. It's an unfortunate position to be in, but I wasn't aware that this meant that none of us were allowed to discuss it, argue about it, or point out facts? When was this decided ? Is that what our democracy now is, post-referendum - not being able to discuss things without being shouted down by angry men who dislike different viewpoints? Being told to agree, shut up or get out? This is what we have now, is it?

Keep throwing those ad hom attacks, by the way.

And the ultimate sneering machine turns up on cue.

Funny really because despite voting Remain I find it's the out brigade that won't listen, heaven forbid we allow the plebs to vote. Just look at your avatar, that man wasn't funny he was a nasty little creep who hated the world but hid it behind a liberal agenda - so am I surprised at your reaction to people who don't see it your way - no. Pseudo intellectuals, is there anything more nauseating.

Didn't tell you I suggested it - to subtle for you?

And in English....?

No point trying to argue with the leavers Look at poor Evan Davis www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_aud ... s/36628894 The leavers are rowing back on every pledge and comment that they made about the economy. Health and spending. The leavers want loads of immigration because it keeps wages down. Want they want is the immigrants to work cheap with no rights and to be able to send them home on a whim. That is because what they want is a country with low paid cheap labour. Roy was right to point out the xenophobia that was highlighted in the campaign. And when the poor uneducated disillusioned disenfranchised realise that the brexiteers have gone back on their pledges then they will look for more right wing parties. Maybe the respectable racism of Farage or the unacceptable of Britain first. Other than polish delis which are identifiable you can guarantee that the big backlash will be those who are visually different from the Brits. Not a good time to be a "darkie" in the Uk moving forward

No point trying to argue with the leavers Look at poor Evan Davis www.bbc.co.uk/news/video_and_aud ... s/36628894 The leavers are rowing back on every pledge and comment that they made about the economy. Health and spending. The leavers want loads of immigration because it keeps wages down. Want they want is the immigrants to work cheap with no rights and to be able to send them home on a whim. That is because what they want is a country with low paid cheap labour. Roy was right to point out the xenophobia that was highlighted in the campaign. And when the poor uneducated disillusioned disenfranchised realise that the brexiteers have gone back on their pledges then they will look for more right wing parties. Maybe the respectable racism of Farage or the unacceptable of Britain first. Other than polish delis which are identifiable you can guarantee that the big backlash will be those who are visually different from the Brits. Not a good time to be a "darkie" in the Uk moving forward

You really can’t help it with the personal attacks can you?

Whist you keep saying you voted “Remain” a part of me thinks you just ticked the wrong box.

To then go into a diatribe about my avatar just proves to me what a self-opinionated ignoramus you are.

We are the 5th biggest economy, though may of had a temporary slip to 6th when the pound and FTSE went south before they recovered. We are probably 2nd biggest player in the Union. Our prosperity has grown over the last 40 years while we have been a member of the EU. No one knows whether it would have been the same, better or worse if over those 40 years we had not been part of the EU. Now it's all down to the deals we can broker directly with the USA, EU and others and whether on our own those deals can be at least as good as the economic block of the EU has negotiated.

Down the line our decision may have wider implications for other EU countries, possibly more than it does for us.

Some political commentators have hailed it as the toppling of the established order, comparing it to the French Revolution. Cameron departs to be replaced by err Johnson. Plus ca change, plus la meme chose.

Vastman showing his self-delusional grandeur once again. Pull your head out of your own 'arris.


When will people realise Brussels or the Conservatives/liberals prop up the same self-serving capitalist elite who will fill their pockets at the expense of the many with your duly "elected" politicians completely complicit. Sooner people realise they don't live in an actual democracy, the sooner we can make some progress. How does it feel to pay your taxes into huge corporation subsidies, corporate/banker bailouts, nuclear weapons, expenses scandals and bombing other countries whilst you're happy that you have reclaimed your country from the monstrosity that is an international government which is about as "democratic"? (Remember one chamber of parliament is a bunch of unelected millionaires but they have the working-classes best interests at heart, right?) Here's an idea: maybe the problem is the so-called democratic government that has been elected in the very country you reside within. The one that has stoked the flames of fascism - intentionally or unintentionally, lied outright to gain support of an issue that will only consolidate their own power and influence and coerced people into creating yet more paranoia and distrust amongst Britains towards the international community.

But this is not a facual account is it?

Firstly Gloucester comfortably voted to leave and not as you stated to remain. Then Birmingham voted to leave also but you prefer to say it was 50/50 while Newcastle voted to remain but by much fewer votes than Birmingham.

Then all the other "facts" you state are just you peddling the findings of a poll. Remember the polls said that Remain would win so they got it wrong yet again. So if you are not into "alternative reality" would you prefer to call it alternative fiction? Talking of fiction I note that your avatar is Sir Humphrey Appleby who undertood the concept of "not-true".. entirely appropriate on this occassion I would say, and interesting that you obviously admire this typical Eurocrat. He is pompous, arrogant, elitist and regards those less-well-educated with contempt.

I like to read the Daily Mail.

I prefer British food to any other.

I think French wine like all things French is over rated.

Love thy neighbour never offended me and still doesn't.

I preferred my job when the workplace was nearly all male.

I don't agree with gay marriage.

I don't trust the Germans.

I detest men who cry in public unless it's due to the loss of a loved one rather than being knocked out of a cooking contest.

Missing out on a holiday becuse you slipped at work and broke your arm is is not devastating, being told you have Cancer and weeks to live is.

I prefer to holiday in the UK because everyone speaks the lingo.........

In the eyes of the Guardian reading musli chugging liberal elitist I'm a troglodite, GREAT I AM.

I AM HOWEVER NOT OFFENDED BY ANYONE WHO DISAGREES WITH ME - THAT IS THEIR RIGHT.

Now I've never been afraid to have and express these opinions despite the near facist lefties who continually bully people not to.

Problem is that a huge number of people in this country seem to varying degrees feel the same - the plebs found their voice on the 23rd and oh boy the bullies can't cope with that can they. Farge want's it to be called Independance day, I'd go further I'd call it liberation day.

I've heard one or two politician claiming that this reforendum has been devisive and that the tone has become far worse. What they actually mean is that they can no longer lord it over people with vague threats of branding people as a "ist" or "phobic" every time they dare expree thier thoughts. Now the plebs talk back and they just can't bare that. Some of the windbags on here are in for a rude awakening in the next few month because once again Britain is at least free as a place where you can have an opinion - god that will annoy them.

Despite being an in not an out and knowingthe risks (yep even a pleb can spot them) I can't help thinking whatever happens it's been worth seeing the self titled "educated working class" and "simpering middle class" being slapped back down by there own people. The rather dim Harrisons goes on about the Tory elite ripping us off yet misses the real issue with staggering ineptitude. The Tories arn't our real enemy, we know what scumbags many of them are - but they are not hiding anything so it's easy to deal with. It's your champagne socialist who are the real enemy of the working man with their rock star mates, three houses and cushy EU jobs lined up for their retirement nest egg (oh wait) - is that self interest I here.

God this is fun, but my rant must stop and I don't suppose it will make any difference - but before I go one point - the much maligned Boris Johnson went to Oxford on merit and according to all his contempories he was the brightest star of his generationwith an IQ and a bredth of knowledge off the scale - unlike Cameron and many a Labour MP who were there at the time. Yet people on here and elsewhere who's intellects are not even close to that of old blondies love to tell us that the mans an idiot, a clown - tells you all you need to know about their arrogance and conciet as not one of those keyboard warriors on here would last five munutes with old Boris, he'd wipe the floor with them, but hey I'm a pleb along with half the electorate and Boris and co are all idiots so what do I know.

I like to read the Daily Express for the McKinstry articles.

I prefer British, Italian and Indian Food.

Up to now I have worked in Spain, Belgium, Romania, France, Germany, Switzerland and Hungary and think for hospitality and honesty the best order is Hungary, Spain, Switzerland, Romania, Belgium, France and Germany.

The last 15 years have been working for the Ministry of Defence in combat systems and the top brass think the EU (Brussels) live in some kind of Alice in Wonderland.

Holidays were Italy and the South of France but now settling for the UK being much safer.

My original thoughts was to REMAIN then I did an intensive study on the workings of the EU, in the meantime Project Fear and Blackmail Threats came to the surface, this raised the value of Liberty and Freedom..............So I voted LEAVE.