FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Hull nicked a win |
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| Quote: Kosh "Can't be right. We are repeatedly assured on here that the officials never, ever affect the outcome of a game. Moreover no mistake by an official is ever as bad as the mistakes made routinely by players and coaches. Ever. So clearly folk need to get off Gansons back as he can in no way shape or form be held responsible.'"
In 99.9% of cases the above is totally correct & I agree that officials almost never effect the outcome of a game... however, for the first time in the video ref era, this unfortunately was that time. Lets also remember the governing body & the official have admitted it was an error and that is also unprecedented in the video ref era.
So what do we do about it?
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| Quote: bren2k "For mine, the game should be retrospectively declared a draw.'"
Under which Operational Rule or Bylaw?
And can we then expect every single game where the ref makes a huge error to have the result set aside? Because that would happen every single week.
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| Quote: Inflatable_Armadillo "In 99.9% of cases the above is totally correct & I agree that officials almost never effect the outcome of a game... however, for the first time in the video ref era, this unfortunately was that time. Lets also remember the governing body & the official have admitted it was an error and that is also unprecedented in the video ref era.
So what do we do about it?'"
Ganson's already apologised. That's all that happens. FC have had loads of apologies from refs and the RFL for game-changing decisions that were incorrect - not a few from Ganson as it happens. No results were set aside. No officials were disciplined. Clubs are specifically forbidden to object to the result of a game based on the decision of an official.
I've been complaining about the quality of refereeing for 25 years. Cock-ups like yesterday happen pretty much every week in games up and down the land. The only difference is this one was on telly.
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| As an Hull fan, I have to admit that it was a truly shocking decision, but still can't believe how surprised or shocked people are.
This is Steve Ganson we are talking about and the guy has more front than Blackpool. We can all go and look at the rules and even double check the small print, but that will be irrelevant really because Steve Ganson is involved.
As fans we have all suffered at the hands of the above mentioned pleb, last season it was us Hull fans who felt robbed, this season it was Hull KR and unfortunately, all the time the RL insist on employing him we will just have to live with it.
The problem the RL has with officials is the lack of options it has. Thaler was also at fault with the last try yesterday which seems to have gone unnoticed, although I recognised his error straight away in the ground. Hull played the ball on the 4th tackle and then when the play was developing, Thaler suddenly decided to indicate (wrongly) that it was 5th and last. This caused confusion in the Hull ranks with Lynch almost coming to a stand still before passing the ball to Houghton who put in an unplanned kick. So Thaler got the tackle count wrong, which I could possibly live with, but he did not indicate that it was the 5th before the ball was played, only after the play was developing. This can be clearly seen on the Sky coverage, but has somewhat gone unnoticed.
Who knows why the try was given, but the above passage of play should highlight to Red Hall once and for all the need for significant investment in the development of competent match officials.
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| Quote: Inflatable_Armadillo "In 99.9% of cases the above is totally correct & I agree that officials almost never effect the outcome of a game... however, for the first time in the video ref era, this unfortunately was that time. Lets also remember the governing body & the official have admitted it was an error and that is also unprecedented in the video ref era.
So what do we do about it?'"
Oh - and BTW...
Eden catches that ball like he should have done and Green being offside is immaterial. If anyone really thinks that Green being 50 metres from Eden at the time of the kick instead of 51, and 20 metres away at the point Eden let the ball bounce, had any effect whatsoever on Eden's attempt at a catch is clutching at straws.
That's another excuse usually trotted out by the ref apologists, isn't it?
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| Quote: Eddie Marks "last year a try was wrongly awarded which cost hull the game. this year a try was wrongly awarded which cost hull kr the game. both were wrong decisions and should have been picked up. but the forward pass last year was so far forward it should also have been seen.
people seem to think its ok to win from a forward pass because theyre more commonly missed.
both are as bad as it changes the result'"
Forward passes get missed every game, we see it week in and out on Sky and at games not televised, this is far more worrying from the games point of view as it clearly shows a decision that is so wrong it cannot be explained or justified. He had every angle to look at it from, he had ample time (which he never used) and he still got it wrong. I also have to ask what the hell Thaler and his linesmen were doing, it clearly shows the linesman DIRECTLY in line with not one, but TWO Hull players in an offside position. We see offsides called by referees all the time and this one was so clear Thaler has to take some of the responsibility.
I will also say, if the idiot Eden had done what any fullback from under 13's upwards would have done, namely catch the bloody thing under no pressure, we would not be debating this. That said, it was Gansons fault and he has to be questioned why he made such a conscious decision when it was clear to all that it was a no try.
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| Has he explained yet why he got the decision wrong? Did he just press the wrong button?
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| Quote: Orrell Lad "Has he explained yet why he got the decision wrong? Did he just press the wrong button?'"
According to reports locally, he 'tracked the wrong player'
TWICE !!!!!
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| Quote: Eddie Marks "so we are saying an honest mistake is unforgivable. more unforgivable then players who deliberately cheat. like holding on to a tackler to milk a penalty(or possibly a sin binning), by throwing a forward pass and know its forward but think the reward is worth the risk given refs miss things, by poleaxing a player and risking him serious injury(and we all know some players have track records for this), by reefing the ball out without the officials seeing and gaining the ball.
all of those things directly influence the outcome of the game. and they are done by players cheating to gain an advantage. on purpose, not an accident.
bad decision yes. but the end result is no different from a try allowed from a forward pass whether in the 5th minute or the 75 minute if those points prove decisive. or if a foward takes a half back out and only goes on report,but the other side are deprived of a play maker. he may get a ban but its no comfort to the side who lost the game due to a lack of ball player.
so therefore everybodys saying making an honest error is worst then deliberately cheating
he got it wrong, get over it. every team in sl has gained results from bad decisions'"
It depends on the magnitude of the error, like it does in society & our countries legal system, mistakes & errors are punishable with varying degree of severity.
Do you speed in your car, have you ever broken the speed limit, even in error? If you have, & statistically I think I know the answer, then do you do it often or not & have you ever been caught & punished? This is a good analogy with the rules of sport. Some players hardly ever break the rules/speed limit and even if they do in error, sometimes they get caught, sometimes they don't. Some players break the rules/speed limit more often as they push the limit of the laws, it is their nature. They probably get caught more often, but they often continue to do so even after being penalised, this can lead to more significant punishments & even a temporary suspension. Some players have a rush of blood to the head & go way beyond the limit of the laws/speed limit & receive a punishment that is instantly more severe or brings about a more severe punishment.
So, now that we have sorted that, lets talk about the Policeman that catches you speeding! It turns out you weren't speeding, the radar gun was working ok & when you review the evidence it proves it beyond reasonable doubt, the Policeman just made a gross error of judgement & did you for speeding! If it was you who were caught speeding and you are rather unhappy when you know you weren't. Then the Police Inspector says, ok, actually we admit we got it wrong, the Policeman did as well, but we are really sorry but that it's, you still have to take the points on your licence & the driving ban... it is just a bit of bad luck you are having mate! How do you feel now?
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| As long as nobody's taking it too serious.
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| Quote: Kosh "Ganson's already apologised. That's all that happens. FC have had loads of apologies from refs and the RFL for game-changing decisions that were incorrect - not a few from Ganson as it happens. No results were set aside. No officials were disciplined. Clubs are specifically forbidden to object to the result of a game based on the decision of an official.
I've been complaining about the quality of refereeing for 25 years. Cock-ups like yesterday happen pretty much every week in games up and down the land. The only difference is this one was on telly.'"
I think you need to take off your black & white glasses for a minute.
Ganson had all the time in the world to review the incident, to check whether he was onside at the kick & track the player involved in the try.
He’s not some sort of rookie, he’s the main man & that decision was inexcusable.
Then we get one eyed FC fans & Gentle for that matter saying “Oh well, it makes up for last year” two wrongs don’t make a right.
Anyhow it will be up there with the all time VR bloopers, but to suggest they happen every week is absurd.
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| Quote: Cock-ups like yesterday happen pretty much every week in games up and down the land. The only difference is this one was on telly.'" ]
And you call me daft!!! Actually, they don't and if you can't see that, you are the daft myopic one here!
I can't think of any other incident in the video ref era which is gross an error as this one. Even Gansongate in 2007 & the errors made by both Klein & Ganson, were not comparable to this error.
So no, err they don't! "
And you call me daft!!! Actually, they don't and if you can't see that, you are the daft myopic one here!
I can't think of any other incident in the video ref era which is gross an error as this one. Even Gansongate in 2007 & the errors made by both Klein & Ganson, were not comparable to this error.
So no, err they don't!
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| Quote: Kosh "Oh - and BTW...
Eden catches that ball like he should have done and Green being offside is immaterial. If anyone really thinks that Green being 50 metres from Eden at the time of the kick instead of 51, and 20 metres away at the point Eden let the ball bounce, had any effect whatsoever on Eden's attempt at a catch is clutching at straws.
That's another excuse usually trotted out by the ref apologists, isn't it?'"
I couldn't agree more.... in all but the last bit!
Let me also add, had Thaler just given the try & would have a massively different opinion on this whole incident &, as I did in 2007, then I would have expected the result to stand & Thaler to have been suspended until thought worthy enough to end up the middle again. However, Mr Thaler didn't make the same mistake as Ganson did in 2007 now did he!!!
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| Quote: rover49 "Forward passes get missed every game, we see it week in and out on Sky and at games not televised'" But not half as many as the fans think as they simply don't understand the forward pass rules.
This decision was however as you say clearly different but you have to live with it. I thought how Hull got possession on the lead up to the penultimate try was also dubious - I think James Child intervened but there wasn't a proper replay of what happened.
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| Quote: MjM "But not half as many as the fans think as they simply don't understand the forward pass rules.
This decision was however as you say clearly different but you have to live with it. I thought how Hull got possession on the lead up to the penultimate try was also dubious - I think James Child intervened but there wasn't a proper replay of what happened.'"
It was clearly accidental offside, nothing wrong with that one.
As for replaying the game, its just a ridiculous suggestion. It was an awful error by Ganson, but it was an error all the same. Bad calls effect results every week and ordering a replay would open a huge can of worms.
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