Why would this happen?

Well suppose the new company started off with 500k. They can use that to pay off the old creditors , and reduce a 6 point fine into a 4 point fine, or they can use the money selfishly to run the club, and make sure they don't risk administration again and a 10 point fine - pretty simple choice if the old creditors needed more than the 500k you have!

The Bradford bulls can attack its debts and problems in anyway it sees fit.
The governing body and the sport in general should then deal with the club accordingly.

This is the second time the club has gone into administration in two years,its clearly living beyond its means or simply taking the s with the blessing of the governing body and the SLE exec.

By increasing the punishment, you encouraging the club to not do the "honourable" thing - the Bradford team may of been a whole lot more sustainable if they hadn't done the honourable thing and carried the debts forward (I believe they did?)

No as we all know by increasing the punishment you force the club to do the honourable thing or they crash & burn.Which is how it should be.

The bradford club would be a whole lot more sustainable playing in front of 4k fans in the second tier with a measly rent of 6k a month and some good sponsors

So making choosing to ignore past debts for the sake of ensuring it doesn't happen again and being able to afford the squad you liked is doing the honourable thing? Because that's the decision increasing punishments incrementally clubs will take.

Or, by keeping it a flat rate, the club is (more) willing to honour the debts it had and thus have no benefit from the whole affair is a bad thing?

When a Club is bought by a new company from the Administrator of the old company, the RFL points deduction penalty on the Club should be based on:
The amount the new company pays the Administrator for the Club and
The amount owing to the creditors as determined by the Administrator.
It's the Administrator that uses this money to pay off the creditors, to the extent possible (after deducting his own fees!)

So any precedent for points deduction should not happen now or in the future because it affects staff, supporters and friends of the club ?
I think that you are starting to clutch at straws now Adey.
Of course these people would be affected, just have many others have been in the past.

How do you think the Rangers football fans felt when they dropped 2 divisions, or Portsmouth fans felt when their points deduction sent them down through the divisions.
I think that you will just have to take a deep breath and accept what is thrown your way, it could yet be little or nothing but, we all have to wait and see.

Bradford Bulls are not an abstract concept though. They are a business operating in SL, under membership of the RFL.

If the new "club" is not the same as the old "club", then they have no RFL membership, no SL licence and as such, need to apply for membership and would need to start in C2.

Thought we were going to find out what/any punishment this week?

My word. The penny has finally dropped. At least with one person. This is indeed, 100% what happens.

The bulls fans need to just accept what (if any) punishment comes their way.

All this fog knitting of semantics and squirming really has shown them up for the worms that they are, a skidmark on the underpants of super league.

But clearly the current Bulls is a continuation club and as such, a points penalty is appropriate.

If it's not a continuation club, this new entity has to apply to start in C2.

They will. (And anyway don't have a choice)


That would be a good description of your status in this forum.

No such thing exists.


I'm not against points penalties, but don't see the connection. The RFL's rules which I quoted, to the annoyance of those who want to simply spout uninformed comment, make it crystal that sanctions are potentially applied to the new owners.


No, again the rules I quoted explain what it can do, it can apply to join the RFL and it can apply for the SL licence. Same as you could.

You see, the advantage of READING what I put, instead of various people having a hissy fit that it's hard cos there's a lot of words innit, would be that you'd actually understand the true position.

The new club has gained a commercial advantage over other clubs by buying from administration. If they had bought the club, debts and all, prior to administration, then there would be less money to buy players with. By buying from administration, you pay less, owe less, and so can spend more on the players. Thus a points penalty applies to the new organisation.

FA: hard work,isn't it?

FA, you can chose to be as obtuse as you like in wilfully missing the point. Which way do you want it?

Is the current club the old Bulls and liable in some extent for the admin mess, or is it an entirely new entity which should have applied for entry to C2?

Assuming the former, you accept that the current incumbents are in line for what some Bulls fans refer to as "punishment"?

Why has the leeds rhinos entity and abstract concept been rewarded with 2 points for beating simon moran's warrington entity?

As the paymaster and decision maker, gary hetherington should have received some renumeration for his victory on friday night to reward his players and fans for the victory as he see's fit.

NO. RFL sanctions are imposed on the CLUB. Eg a six point deduction.

Clubs continue as Members of the RFL so long as they have an extant owner. Albeit owners come and go.

The Bradford club record for tries in a season is 63 by Jack McLean in 1951-52. The fact there have been various owners (Bradford Northern ltd, Bradford Northern (1964) ltd, Bradford bulls holdings ltd, OK Bulls ltd, Bradford bulls (2014) ltd or whatever) is irrelevant.

Sanctions are applied to the CLUB - and potential new owners decide whether or not they want to buy the Club in those circumstances.

Steve O'Connor's Widnes club were unable to take the licence the first time round because it was so soon after Vaughan's Widnes club crashed and burned. The RFL punished the club.

Not necessarily so. You would have to assume that had the new owners run the old club, they would have made such a porridge of it as they did. They might have done a lot better with the same money. Also the idea that the Bulls have a commercial advantage over the rest of SL clubs does sound like rubbish, doesn't it? Any of you want to swop places? No? Didn't think so.


A points penalty MAY apply and in the rules it is nothing to do with what you say. I didn't write them.

:me5undm7
What point is that?

:me5undm7
No, and no. Obviously.

:me5undm7
Yes.

:me5undm7
It might have to. The procedure (as we at Bradford know only too well) is you have to join the RFL, then apply to play in whatever league. It is up to them if they admit you and it is up to them/SLE if they accept the league you want to play in. There is no "should have" here. Anyone, anytime, can apply to join, and can apply to play in any league.


Look, man, it is ME that quoted the SPECIFIC RULE in FULL that leads to the RFL being able to apply sanctions TO THE NEW OWNERS. A bit nonsensical, then, to ask me, of all people?

It is.

What happens next is that the people who ask me strings of specific questions and make numerous specific claims then get all y and feign annoyance when I answer them.



It's apparently OK to MAKE 20 points. But absolutely not on to RESPOND to the points made.

So the rules lie. I see.


Sothe rules that require the owning company to be admitted to membership are wrong. I see.


Not at all. Fans identify with their hometown or chosen team and always will. They aren't that bothered about the legalities. But you're confusing spiritual or emotional attachment. Nobody, for example, ever felt the slightest kinship or affection or loyalty as a fan to Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd. But, that entity was the member of the RFL.


Rubbish. Even you must know that. The new owners have been granted membership and a temporary licence and as such, under the rules (which sadly I quoted and sadly you won't read) it is a term of that admission to membership that the RFL can apply sanctions to that member. Unless of course, yet again, the written rules are wrong.

If there was no new owner of the Bulls, then there WOULD BE NO Bradford Bulls club, and as such, nothing to apply sanctions to.