Is that situation not much different to SL clubs buying top NRL players though? It's also a smaller cap, and an even bigger move.

The cap being 'live' doesn't mean people can't cheat. Look at Melbourne. All it means is clubs can't accidentally go over by miscalculating the books. They actually have to physically cheat the books to avoid notice.

A smaller cap , but still full time , and yes a bigger geographical distance , but once again , still one FT job for another , however FT isn't doable on 300 K , so traveling 2/3 hours to training for part time pay isn't the norm , so when a club has half a team doing it , it's not surprising that fans question it

You will no doubt now try to find some other ambiguous scenario to back up your misguided opinion

They were cheating , we knew they were cheating , the RFL are not completely stupid , but without either physical evidence or a ' whistleblower ' it is very difficult , we agree , but that is their job to regulate these things

Catic in August www.code13rugbyleague.com/2011/0 ... -comments/

Catic in August www.code13rugbyleague.com/2011/0 ... -comments/

double post

It's not the norm, but it does happen, so it's not exactly a barometer for the RFL to come in and poke around. The RFL need to have trust on that the clubs are behaving honourably. Otherwise people will then complain (no doubt you at the forefront of whingers) that they are being over zealous and should be spending their time doing something else rather than chasing speculation on false pretences.


What would this misguided opinion be? That the RFL shouldn't investigate every fan-based rumour? They need a tip off to see how someone is cheating, not speculation. Not even the mighty NRL could stop Melbourne doing it over a four year period.

Just like the police, the RFL are powerless until they have evidence. But again in typical RL fans fashion, personal opinion has clouded a rational judgement and it is now the RFL's fault that Barrow cheated.

Because when dealing with something like this, and a club deliberately trying to circumvent the cap, it takes time to get the necessary evidence not only to show what you think they have done, but to prove it.

Imagine the outcry, and i expect it would be same minority of moaners who are always moaning, if the RFL 'jumped the gun' and judged and punished Barrow before they had dotted the i's and crossed the t's and Barrow appealed the decision and won on a technicality? It would be a national embarrassment.

So what's the point of harking of the benefits of a 'live' cap if it takes 4 years of offences before a club is made accountable?!

because there are benefits to the live cap, we dont need to hide them under a bushel. But there is not system, rule, or operating system which would stop a concerted and systematic attempt to circumvent the cap, except getting rid of it and looking to a more open and transparent talent spreading system which doesnt rely on financial circumstances which people understandably have a right to keep private.

Matt , were still waiting for the results of the thorough investigation into ' Visagate ' , there were some very twitchy bottoms at Red Hall a couple of years back

Good to see the RFL come down hard on blatant cheating. Also, the Wigan comparison is not that fair really. Wigan tried to stay under the cap by (as I understanding) asking players to defer salary until next year, whereas Barrow have just blatantly cheated and tried to cover it up. It's like the difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion. Wigan were trying to work around the rules but keep it technically 'legal' and got done for being outside of the spirit of the cap, but didn't try to cover it all up which is what Barrow seem to have being doing. Whether we ever find out the true extent of Des's cheating up there I guess we'll have to wait and see. Whether the cap is live or not, if you are going to put the effort in to hide stuff, then it's pretty hard for the RFL to get the proof without a whistleblower or a cock up by the cheater. I'm sure if an SL club get done for something similar they will be on the end of a similar points deduction. RFL get a lot of stick but they've got this bang on for me. This is the first case of someone getting done for systemic and deliberate flouting of the cap and puts a good marker down for anything thinking of doing something similar.

The main thing for me is that Des is now out of the game which is good, but I really hope Barrow can recover from this and bounce back. Must be tough for their fans at the moment, but long term you are much better off without Des in charge as long as the club can survive this crisis.

Believe it or not, there is no system that will allow clubs to not cheat. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be a system in place to make it more difficult to.

The 'live' cap stops clubs from messing up the books, which was IIRC what all the SL offences have been on the past. The fact we haven't had a breach in the time it's been in place is a testament to that. That's the point.

Given that the Crusaders club has now been placed in liquidation, I'd imagine that that's been quietly dropped (to sighs of relief in some quarters!).

But would they get relegated to the Championship? Barrow got double punishment by losing 29 points and then relegation a SL club would not be relegated if they had a similar points punishment!!!!

There is no relegation in SL, so no.

However, the RFL could expel them if they wished, and it would work against them in their next license bid. Since this is a stand alone case in this country, there is nothing to compare it to. It cannot be compared to other breaches as they are nowhere near the same offence.

Yet