Thanks for that quality input to the debate there.

Would Sinfield be as effective at club level if he hadn't been the captain of a team full of his best mates for 10 + years ?
he has the luxury at Leeds of being part of an untouchable group of players who are pretty good at peaking at the right time.
If he was at say Salford would the media rave about him as much or would he just look like an average player in an average team?
I've watched Sinfield's career from the start and rarely in all that time have i ever watched him and thought " wow that was brilliant" or other gobsmacked phrase to describe what he's done on the field. I have many times for Brough, Tomkins, Chase etc, even McGuire in the past - like i said he's a good leader and captain of his mates but no exciting genius with ball in hand.

You've watched his career from the start? Really because the rest of your post implys that you've hardly watched him at all.

BINGO!!

So Leeds' and SL's most succesful captain has just been a bit lucky cos he's played with his mates.

Really?

He hasn't been put in any position yet, as far as I'm aware the team for the WC is quite a long way off being announced

RE Ian Kirk, take him out of the rhinos team and they would still have won all the titles, could you really say the same about Sinfield?

Just take last seasons run to the grand final for example, he was the best player on the pitch in every one of those games.

I think the nail was hit in a previous post.
sinfield is a very good leader and organiser but not a creative spark compared to other half backs.
brough is a very good creator who has that spark of genius in him.

they are both good at what they do, but at this moment in time,regardless of how many medals sinfield has won along with his team mates, brough is the all round better half back IMO

Not in that context no , but yes in a way because he has been able to carry on doing what he does at Leeds and have the team built around his leadership, if he had left Leeds he would have had to fit into another team with unfamiliar players around him. At Leeds he's had other players over the years to do the creating while he leads....What Sinfield does at Leeds is probably something he can only do at Leeds because of what they have built there !.

He is, when he wants to be, which doesn't appear to be all of the time, or consistently which is why at 30 he's had five different clubs and only a CC club medal to his name (in a game where Sinfield won the the Lance Todd Trophy funnily enough).

Talking of that Sinfield has won MOM in 2 tests against NZ, 2 SL grand finals, 1 CC Final, 1 WCC.

Look, for all of that if Brough keeps his form up and is playung well at the end of the season I would have no qualms in having him in the squad or side, perhaps a 6 & 7 of Sinfield and Brough would work?

But this while hyperbole about Brough being some kind of saviour for the England squad is getting a bit silly IMO, the team and squad hasn't been announced yet, he may well be in there, who knows!

To be honest, i think Mcnamara as already chosen his squad apart from 1 or 2 spots. I personally would have widdop at 6 and Brough at 7 and maybe Sinfield at 13. But i just don't think we have a chance with Sinfield at 6 IHO

So if Leeds have been successful by building a team around Sinfield to allow him to do what he does best, why can't England do the same?

I don't think there would be a single player in that England squad who has anything but the utmost respect for Kevin as a player and a leader. If you listen to other players and coaches talking about him, it's always in glowing terms.

Pick him at six, pick a creative halfback alongside him (whether it be Brough, Widdop or whoever) and have Tomkins linking in from full back in the way Brent Webb used to do at Leeds to give the extra playmaking option.

Let him take the side around the park and lead with others playing off him.

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