Saracens crowds to most assuredly give you a very accurate indicator as to which is the bigger code in the UK/England......or do you wish to narrow the criteria further and say Yorkshire? Unless you can find me a recent RL game in SL that attracted an 80k odd crowd to a neutral venue.....regardless of the means by which it was achieved i'd suggest that Union is some way ahead of League in all the important "off-field" aspects.
Speaking of problems faced by the Rugby lot....they have a very strong leadership model that usually gets things sorted. Nobody has ever said they don't face "issues"......what I have always said is that they deal with these issues better.
I may have been remiss in comparing the RFL turn over to Ireland Rugby......Maybe I should have been fairer and used the Scots or Welsh RFU......which incidentally, also both turn over more than the RFL.......but I won't, I'll use the RFU which essentially dwarfs the RFL in all aspects of governance, finance and public awareness. The RFU "domestic enough for you"?



Actually, I think you'll find it was the Loiner idiot who baited the hook and went down this route.....blame him. As for your subsequent insecurity attack....that's really down to you if you can't see the wood for the trees.




Alas, being a realist and admitting that the double-header crowds were not actually 67k for each games is far healthier than clinging to some form of security blanket in the reality that the 2nd games at both Cardiff and Wembley were not attended by anything like the numbers that you snuggle up to for comfort. The fact that to cause even a ripple of interest DOMESTICALLY the comp had to use these "event games" shows that the game is learning from the RFU/IRB.......so there's hope yet

complex and complicated arent the same.

The new system isnt complicated, people arent too stupid to understand it.

It is quite complex, there are many different parts and permutations. It goes from a simple league structure with added extra game, to an unfamiliar split with different clubs playing each other in what are essentially different competitions before a very short play-off series in some parts, and then a play off between 3 and 4th in a middle league to start a new competition in a possibly different league next year but possibly finishing that year in the same one they ended this.

The big worry is that the new structure and its complexity and different parts stops people buying season tickets and pushes them to pick and choose more games or even periods of the season to attend because it will be very very difficult to convince those people to move back to season tickets. Many people buy a season ticket because thats what they do, thats what they have always done, they attend some games more out of habit and duty. Once that habit is broken its really difficult to get them back. If that does happen then attendances will drop significantly. Maybe not precipitously or dramatically, but a steady repeated decrease. A 4% decrease is not all that alarming. Probably not worth worrying too much about really. An average of 4% per year over 5 years is 20% + what we have seen in 2013 and this year and we could have lost a third of our attendees from 2012 by 2019 including what should have been a significant pre and post World Cup legacy bump which has somehow morphed in to a decent loss of fans.

Yet more irrelevant drivel.
You don't get it do you? No-one has said RL is bigger. No-one. Yet you come up with all this rubbish to prove a point no-one disputed so that you can feel superior and can try and portray everyone else as insecure.
Tell us again how Saracens crowds, you know significantly lower than Leeds & Wigan's crowds prove it's the far bigger & better run code?
Oh wait, they can't!

Again, you're not getting it. No-one is saying the RFL is bigger or better than the RFU. But go and actually talk to some hardcore RU fans and they'll talk of a similar disillusionment with the governing body as RL fans do.
So there's no need for all that rubbish you posted, everyone knows that already.


Ah there's the old "insecurity" line! Don't tell me! I've a chip on my shoulder too!
Once again, you don't get it. Everyone knows Union is bigger internationally and nationally. That still doesn't make every aspect of Union better or perfect. If it were then Saracens wouldn't get an average crowd of only 8,500. But then doesn't fit the agenda does it.

I agree in that it's not really that complicated, but as I said earlier in the thread I don't think the league system has or will have much effect on attendances. I think that's much more down to individual clubs situations.
It may give a slight boost to Championship clubs attendances with the possibility for promotion but again I think the club itself & the economy have a much bigger role to play.

Yep, last year I remember taking down the attendances that the Aviva Premiership gave for its clubs and Quins came out with an average of 18k and Sarries 16k, not bad for two clubs whose stadia have a legal capacity of 14,816 and 10,000 respectively.

Lies, lies and damned statistics! Lmao!

I don't know what the truth is, and to be honest I don't care, I'd rather focus on RL and getting it right for us and doing whats best for us.

Too much worry about nothing I feel. It will be fine. Once it's in, people will easily understand and engage with it. Anyway, 3 or 4 million turned out to watch the Tour de France in Yorkshire. Not many of those will understand or even know about how that works. But it doesn't matter. They turn out, watch & enjoy.

Check out the on the road games they play.......same as when London broncos go to gillingham or parramatta take games into Sydney or the warriors play at Eden park.........as you say Pete.....you don't know!

I agree that clubs bare a lot of responsibility for the attendances. However we cannot and should not minimise the effect of the environment the structure creates for those clubs to work in.

Well we do know. We know that outliers in a small data set can hugely distort averages. We know that saying a clubs average attendance exceeded the capacity of its stadium because of one or two outliers is misrepresentative

Sorry what? Because I referenced you constantly bleating about other sports every time you make a post that's supposed to prove something?

Not that I didn't know this before but you're completely off your nut.

I didn't bait any hook you moron and the fact you think I did and that you've tried to derail yet another thread into a Union discussion just reinforces how obsessed you are. It's really sad.

All I said was if you're going to use event games when posting your figures for other sports then you need to include event games like Magic Weekend when posting RL figures. It's not rocket science and that applies to any sport.

Now please do us all a favour and STFU about Union, no one cares. If we did there'd be 100s of other threads on the subject. There's another forum for other sports if you want to talk about it and it's about as busy as the London away end is at any SL match.....

But union is the most popular code, the better run code and the bigger code. People just need to accept that and stop trying to better union. Embrace what we have and dont worry about what the RFU are doing.

Regards

King James

Hi Billy, how's your off-season going?

The first mention of any other sport......and therefore, the moment of derailment.

....Wembley "event games"was a direct reference to Union. Denying it just shows how insecure you really are.



Hmmm. I can think of a number of NRL clubs that are "punching above their weight" attendance wise using the logic that you employ. The fact that clubs manage to increase their averages by hosting games at bigger venues is something that should be applauded and copied.........The Warriors see the benefit of shipping a game 700kms south to get a big crowd. They also moved 3 games across town to boost their attendances too.......last effort at their real home was a tad disappointing by comparison though. It really is a sign of insecurity when a Union club does something it gets lambasted but when the mighty NRL does it it's seen as fine

Gutters talking about union, who'd have thought it?

Moving on, we should see an increased avg attendance next year without london's embarrassing efforts, though we may see big drop off in the middle 8 league when it starts.