FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Thoughts about exiles game |
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| Just asking from an Aussie perspective will this have an annual event like Origin?
From this side of the world we've only heard good things from the match
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| Quote: Ant80 "Just asking from an Aussie perspective will this have an annual event like Origin?
From this side of the world we've only heard good things from the match'"
Talks are underway about whether this is repeated next year and onwards
When the fixture was announced there was some scepticism (myself included) but in pretty much every element it was a success – the attendance was good (although the crowd was a little quiet which is to be expected when it is a new fixture) and the game was well contested and played in the manner of an international match (i.e. lots of contact at the ruck and therefore slower play the balls)
There has been widespread agreement over the past couple of decades that State of Origin has helped the Aussie team to dominate international league due to it preparing the players for high intensity matches – whether this is true or not is up for debate as the NZ team seems to do well enough without a similar event. My feeling is that the week to week intensity of the NRL is a more important factor and that needs to be matched by SL (which is getting better year on year in this regard) in order for the English team to compete
As a fixture it can certainly help our International team – I don’t think it will reach the profile of SOO as that benefits from two sets of partisan fans that, by definition, can’t exist for International Origin but I hope that it continues
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| Quote: Hear Ye! "I'm not saying Wales don't deserve that spot in the 4N's...I fully understand the need for teams like Wales, France, PNG etc to get a chance against the "big 3" teams in the world. If we're honest though, will Wales win a game in the 4N's? I for one hope they do (against Aus or NZ
You're missing the point. It's about the structure of the international game and being long term. Whatever the problems Italy have in the six nations they will come good, france in the same comp got hammered for decades! But they stuck by the structure. Without this structure wales, france, png et al will never be competitive. How can you expect a team not getting regular exposure to that level to suddenly make some magic leap? The exiles are a good short term measure but beyond a good trial for england mid-season it is a dead end for the long term future of the international game.
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| The exiles being in the 4 nations would make a mockery of the tournament and International Rugby League. U cant enter sides into International Test Rugby League who have no nationality. It would be laughable.
Its much more important to push forward in growing the game in the fringe nations and helping them improve!!
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| Quote: Dunbar "(although the crowd was a little quiet which is to be expected when it is a new fixture) '"
A classic example of a 'think about what you have just typed before you click the submit button' post
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| Quote: Odemwingie "The squad at the end of the year will be much different though.
Brough will no doubt replace Myler who is a good support player but rubbish at this level, even wire fans can see that. Brough has an awesome kicking game and will control the play as well as being creative.
Roby will play instead of McIlorum. McIlorum does the job and will never let anyone down but he is not ready for this level YET. Roby is one of the top hookers in the world and is always superb at international level.
Burgess and Ellis will play. An argument could be made that these are Englands two best players, they play with the worlds best week in week out and are now two of the best back rowers in the NRL while Burgess can also play prop.
Widdop will probably play at 6 or FB... he should play 6 IMO. He has looked quality for Melbourne this year, he could easily hide behind Cronk, Slater and Smith but he never does.
Adding these 5 players to that starting 13 improves the team by a long way IMO.
Finally you also have Hock who will no doubt put his hand up with the amount of talent he has... maybe if we are lucky he has found half a brain cell in his two years out. You also have Crabtree who didn't play in this game and has always performed for England.
On an extra note I thought Joel Tomkins had a good game and has looked awesome for Wigan at centre IMO. He should be in contention there, he reads the game well and has loads of pace for a big guy, nobody got near him. Shenton looked like he was running in treacle.
After these players have been added we could end up with something like this....
Tomkins
Hall
Shenton/J Tomkins/Bridge
Shenton/J Tomkins/Bridge
Briscoe
Widdop
Brough
Morley
Roby
Peacock
Ellis
Burgess
Lockers
Westwood - Englands MOM made for internationals.
Robinson
Both should be on the bench IMO they deserve it. Then we have a list of players in the running for the final bench spot after Crabtree who also deserves it.
Mossop
Hock
Griffin
LMS
J Tomkins - if he doesn't make the centre position.
Players like Myler, Sinfield and Wilkin should not be in the team. Sinfield could play 9 if needed but not if we are at full strength.'"
The back line still isn't good enonough, the fact that Joel Tomkins is being considered for the centres just shows hoe desperatly short of centres we are. I hope Lawrence, Watkins and Charnley all have good ends to the season and push for selection because the current options are no where near good enough., and there's no gurantee that Ellis or Burges will play in the 4 nations.
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| Quote: Odemwingie "He was Englands best player, he was made for international rugby. He can raise his intensity in the tackle. He is the first name on the bench for me and the first player in if Ellis and Burgess get injured.'"
Thing is though, Westwood is as near as wasted on the bench and doesn't get to show his full potential. He's not an impact player, he's a player who, from the first whislte, is straight in giving 100%. He normally plays the full game for Warrington, and as seen when he's started on the bench for England in the part he doesn't perform as well as he does starting. IMO, you'd be better off playing Graham on the bench with Burgess at prop, as we know Graham can make a difference coming off the bench and would give us a better impact.
Westwood, along with Monaghan and Briers is the first name I look for when the squads are announced. I don't think people realize how good he actually is. He's hard as nail, 100% commited, a great tackler, a great metre-maker and rarely tires. I know stats don't show the whole picture but I believe they state he is currently better than Luke O'Donnel or Ryan Hoffman. He'd do very well in the NRL IMO, he has a great mould for it and has the attributes that the Aussies love over there.
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| Quote: PHIPPS "
Why? What's wrong with what you have quoted?
She would expect awesome atmosphere's for untested fixtures?
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| If England had held on and won Eddie and Stevo would have been banging on about how it was proof that England are good enough to Australia and New Zealand. Not that the final try should have been scored mind as there is no way that two defenders should bounced off the ball carrier like that. The Exiles looked like that they could have sliced through the English defence and scored at will while we had to rely on their mistakes to score, as we wouldn't have broken through their defence even if they played until midnight.
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| A team full of 30+ year old Aussies and Kiwis (with the odd exception) beat England. Is this further proof that we need less overseas players playing in SL?
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| average age of the exiles was 29...with 200 caps between them...proof,if we needed it, that the exiles we're deservedly favourites for the game
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| Quote: roughyedspud "average age of the exiles was 29...with 200 caps between them...proof,if we needed it, that the exiles we're deservedly favourites for the game'"
Behave
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| Quote: Wellsy13 "Why? What's wrong with what you have quoted?
She would expect awesome atmosphere's for untested fixtures?'"
So you think because the Exiles v England match has never been played before that means the supporters are in some way scared to generate any atmosphere?
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| Quote: Odemwingie "The squad at the end of the year will be much different though.
Brough will no doubt replace Myler who is a good support player but rubbish at this level, even wire fans can see that. Brough has an awesome kicking game and will control the play as well as being creative.
Roby will play instead of McIlorum. McIlorum does the job and will never let anyone down but he is not ready for this level YET. Roby is one of the top hookers in the world and is always superb at international level.
Burgess and Ellis will play. An argument could be made that these are Englands two best players, they play with the worlds best week in week out and are now two of the best back rowers in the NRL while Burgess can also play prop.
Widdop will probably play at 6 or FB... he should play 6 IMO. He has looked quality for Melbourne this year, he could easily hide behind Cronk, Slater and Smith but he never does.
Adding these 5 players to that starting 13 improves the team by a long way IMO.
Finally you also have Hock who will no doubt put his hand up with the amount of talent he has... maybe if we are lucky he has found half a brain cell in his two years out. You also have Crabtree who didn't play in this game and has always performed for England.
On an extra note I thought Joel Tomkins had a good game and has looked awesome for Wigan at centre IMO. He should be in contention there, he reads the game well and has loads of pace for a big guy, nobody got near him. Shenton looked like he was running in treacle.
After these players have been added we could end up with something like this....
Tomkins
Hall
Shenton/J Tomkins/Bridge
Shenton/J Tomkins/Bridge
Briscoe
Widdop
Brough
Morley
Roby
Peacock
Ellis
Burgess
Lockers
Westwood - Englands MOM made for internationals.
Robinson
Both should be on the bench IMO they deserve it. Then we have a list of players in the running for the final bench spot after Crabtree who also deserves it.
Mossop
Hock
Griffin
LMS
J Tomkins - if he doesn't make the centre position.
Players like Myler, Sinfield and Wilkin should not be in the team. Sinfield could play 9 if needed but not if we are at full strength.'"
Wilkin was one of the best players on the pitch
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| Regularly playing against the Aussies and Kiwis doesn't appear to have made England/GB better of late. Given that, why does anyone seem to think that playing a side comprised of mainly over the hill pension fillers be any better?
What is needed is cutting edge coaching & training techniques and infrastructure to develop players to the highest level.
It's a common misconception that SOO is the reason for Aussie dominance, but it began in 1980 which is just two years before the Invincibles destroyed GB.
That 1082 Kangaroo squad came from fitness and coaching systems put in place following the 1970 Lions tour and that have been built on ever since.
The answer is behind the scenes, not in a gimmick game.
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