are you talking about the WC's?

I don't know how we're meant to expand - I'm no businessman, but I think we've tried the top down system, it's failed. We've tried a bottom up approach - it's also failed. The only system that's worked is having two perfectly viable clubs (St Esteve and XII Catalan), merge and form a better club that could compete, it had an existing fan base (albeit a small one) and has most of what it needed to be successful, despite having a couple of blips, we have seen France become a new found force in RL, crowds have gone up, and up, and up, relying entirely on the tourists and the home supporters. That's excellent IMO. That's the best way forward, we need to look at where the existing clubs are, and work from there, if we see an influx of fans to an area. In Wales, we now have the infrastructure, and the smaller, but noticeable fan base, now it needs to have players that can become symbols in the local area. A Second Welsh Team, far off yet, but if it does come could create an unforgettable rivalry, and a marquee game for RL in Wales.

I can dream anyway.

well said,mon ami

Really? What evidence is there to suggest expansion hasn't worked in the Rugby League Conference?

Indeed... from 12 teams in 1997 to the list below 13 years later - what a failure

RLC National
Bramley Buffaloes
Carlisle
Dewsbury Celtic
Featherstone Lions
Hemel Stags
Huddersfield Underbank Rangers
Kippax Knights
Liverpool Buccaneers
Nottingham Outlaws
Warrington Wizards

Midlands Premier
Birmingham Bulldogs
Gloucestershire Warriors
Leicester Storm
Coventry Bears
Derby City
Bristol Sonics

Yorkshire Premier
East Leeds
Haworth Park
Milford Marlins
Moorend Thorne
Rotherham Giants
Scarborough Pirates
York Lokomotive

North West Premier
Lymm
New Broughton Rangers
Runcorn
Widnes Saints
Wigan Riversiders

Wales Premier
Blackwood Bulldogs
Bridgend Blue Bulls
Cardiff Demons
CPC Bears
Newport Titans
Valley Cougars

Premier South
Eastern Rhinos
Hainault Bulldogs
Hammersmith Hill Hoists
London Skolars
Portsmouth Navy Seahawks
South London Storm
St Albans Centurions
West London Sharks

Womens South
Northampton Demons Ladies
Nottingham Outlaws
Coventry Bears
West London Sharks Women

Womens East
Keighley Cats
Whinmoor
Leeds Akkies
Brighouse Ladies
Stanningley Ladies
Guisley

Womens West
Warrington
Wigan Ladies
Halton
Chorley Panthers

Midlands Regional
Birmingham Bulldogs 'A'
Coventry Bears 'A'
Leamington Royals
North East Worcestershire Ravens
Nottingham Outlaws 'A'
Telford Raiders

Yorkshire Regional
Barnsley Broncos
Bradford Victoria Rangers
Leeds Akkies
Lincoln City Knights
Parkside Hawks
Shorpe Barbarians
Wetherby Bulldogs
Shaw Cross Sharks

North West Regional
Crewe & Nantwich Steamers
Chester Gladiators
Wigan Riversiders 'A'
Mancunians RL
Blackpool Sea Eagles

Wales Regional
Amman Valley Rhinos
Merthyr Wildcats
Neath Port Talbot Steelers
Dinefwr Sharks
Torfaen Tigers
West Wales Wild Boars

South West Regional
South Dorset Giants
Plymouth Titans
East Devon Eagles
Devon Sharks
Exeter Centurions
Somerset Vikings
North Devon Raiders
South Somerset Warriors

South East Regional
Sussex Merlins
Oxford Cavaliers
Swindon St George
Greenwich Admirals
South London Storm 'A'
Elmbridge Eagles
Guildford Giants
Southampton Spitfires

East Regional
Bury Titans
St Albans Centurions 'A'
Bedford Tigers
Northampton Demons
Norwich City Saxons
St Ives Roosters

North East Regional
Northallerton Stallions
Cramlington Rockets
Sunderland Nissan
Newcastle Storm
Jarrow Vikings
Peterlee Pumas
Durham Demons
Wallsend Eagles
Whitley Bay Barbarians
Winlaton Warriors

Scotland Regional
Ayrshire
Kirkcaldy
Easterhouse Panthers
Carluke Tigers
Edinburgh Eagles
Fife Lions
Falkirk
Moray Eels

A slightly out of date list, but a point well made.

Have we ?

It doesn't matter which way you do it , if you dont treat it like a ' real ' business it will fail , the Catalans were due to enter SL in 2005 , they asked for another season to prepare ,because they knew they weren't ready , the Welsh club in Bridgend was not ready , but they were rushed in , they were at least 3 years away from being strong enough to be considered for SL

The only way any club will succeed from outside the heartlands [ and Catalans were in the heartlands no matter what anybody ' pretends ' ] is if they are funded independantly to any other club , the only way this can be done without causing massive upset to clubs/fans and the sport in general is if it is done through the RFL , this applies to both clubs at Championship level and SL

RL lacks credibility? Even in comparison to;

FIFA
Italian soccerball
Soccerball hooliganism
Wayne Rooney
Snooker - John Higgins
Pakistani cricket team
Blood and machanical doping in cycling
Golf - Tiger Woods
South African Atheletics - Caster Semenya

Add to that list the RFU disciplinary board, former Harlequins RU coach Dean Richards, current player Tom Williams and recent revelations that one of Spain's all time top athletes is [ireportedly[/i heavily involved in a doping scandal. (rlMarta Dominguezrl).

But yeah, RL lacks credibility because it wants to replace one of its long-time underperforming clubs with a better performing club

the difference in crowds between the expansion club Crusaders, and heartland (dont make me laugh) club Catalans prior to bringing them into SL was about 300,

We spent 100 years trying a bottom up approach it failed miserably, after ten years of trying it the other way with at least one successful pro club, and lots of success in the amateur scene at another, we have some fools wanting to go back to a system we know doesnt work. Its crazy

Crusaders didnt work initially, we know its been a bumpy ride but look at RL in Wales now compared to 5 years ago.. you're telling me that isnt progress?
We've fallen rolled and with a stroke of luck reached somewhere, im just not sure how we should have got there in the first place. One could argue 3 more years in the Chp would have done them good, im not sure that was the right call.
The only thing we've learnt for definate over the SL expansion era, for me, would be to say, like Catalans you're in at *insert date* no matter what; spend the next 2/3 years preparing.

That is the BIG thing.

After this set of franchises. Any Club at any time can bid for a place, if they are accepted they have three years to prepare in the lower leagues, then you are in.

Clubs in there are constantly assessed and if they are continually failling they are dropped.