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FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Reforming the International Game |
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| Quote: ap1717 "
Yeah, great, a bunch of small nations with a handful of professionals between them play in front of fewer people than Fev get for a home game, and international RL is on the up. Yeah, right.
Regular games against ANZAC need to be the preserve of a joint side so there's no conflict in playing for Wales/Scotland and playing top-level RL. Similarly, by allowing players to play for Wales, Scotland & Ireland you make internationals between the home nations competitive, so people might actually care about them. The Ireland side above would give England a run for their money.
The situation is reflected down under, where SOO needs to be opened to non-Australians, so that the likes of Uate, Tuqiri & Hayne can play for their respective countries of origin, rather than hold out for a Kangaroos & QLD/NSW jersey.
An RLWC (and the RLIF needs to get some money together to start legal proceedings against the IRB to get them to make themselves the IRUB and their event the RUWC) that had competitve Australia, New Zealand, Fiji, Samoa, Tonga, England, Scotland, Ireland, Wales & France teams would be an international product that we could sell. So would Lions tours and a regular European Championship. That not only gets prestige and money into the game, it gets people. Paddy from Dublin probably doesn't know or care about Wigan, Leeds & Catalans, but if he sees an Ireland side performing well, he might well start to. And if one particular side (for Ireland, Wigan & Warrington) contain lots of Irish/Welsh/Scottish players, he might start to care for them too.
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| I would love to see a 5 nations competition between England, Wales, Scotland, Ireland and France. Ok England will dominate for a few years but once players commit to a nation and the competitions profile increases, more and more players will become more competitive to fight for a GB jersey to play test series against the aussies and kiwis. I like the idea but it will never happen unfortunately because RL fans don't give a toss about the international game.
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| Quote: Tyke's/Rhinos No. 1 Fan "Yeah, great, a bunch of small nations with a handful of professionals between them play in front of fewer people than Fev get for a home game, and international RL is on the up. Yeah, right.
Regular games against ANZAC need to be the preserve of a joint side so there's no conflict in playing for Wales/Scotland and playing top-level RL. Similarly, by allowing players to play for Wales, Scotland & Ireland you make internationals between the home nations competitive, so people might actually care about them. The Ireland side above would give England a run for their money.
The situation is reflected down under, where SOO needs to be opened to non-Australians, so that the likes of Uate, Tuqiri & Hayne can play for their respective countries of origin, rather than hold out for a Kangaroos & QLD/NSW jersey.
An RLWC (and the RLIF needs to get some money together to start legal proceedings against the IRB to get them to make themselves the IRUB and their event the RUWC) that had competitve Australia, New Zealand, Fiji, Samoa, Tonga, England, Scotland, Ireland, Wales & France teams would be an international product that we could sell. So would Lions tours and a regular European Championship. That not only gets prestige and money into the game, it gets people. Paddy from Dublin probably doesn't know or care about Wigan, Leeds & Catalans, but if he sees an Ireland side performing well, he might well start to. And if one particular side (for Ireland, Wigan & Warrington) contain lots of Irish/Welsh/Scottish players, he might start to care for them too.'"
Firstly,
Canada's Latest Home Attendances: 4,630 (vs Jamaica) 2,300 (vs Lebanon), 4,675 (vs USA)
Featherstones?: 2,816 (vs Keighley), 2,068 (vs Swinton)
And to think every single Canadian player was amatuer that's some effort against a team that has decades upon decades of tradition in a heartland Rugby League area (no disrespect aimed at Fev here). But if according to you the international game is dead then so is the championship and a few members of Super League.
Secondly,
Allowing a bunch of players from the north of England and east coast of Australia with certain heritages to represent your country doesn't necessarily attract crowds, although these players may be proud as punch to rep their heritage. Pal, let me speak from experience of following Wales, watching a team with Lloyd White, Gil Dudson, Ben Flower who are all young Welsh born lads means more to the watching public than the pathetic team we mustered with no proper Welsh lads together in 2007 that failed WC qualification... that team? Hit no passion and touched no heartstrings with me, just like most of the players would never represent my country again. Why? Wales to them was a quick trip to Australia for a world cup.
Thirdly,
By opening Origin up to every man and his dog with plenty of nationalities represented infuriates Australians who are represented by Queenslanders and NSWelshman, imagine the example of Sam Kasiano was followed on for anotehr decade.. it'd be a joke with 'Queensland' and 'NSW' just being names to which mean nothing to half the players.
Lastly that WC bit,
To an extent i agree. Having 6/7 strong nations in a WC is vital. However doing it via heritage players and ring-ins doesn't work. The international game needs time! Tonga and Samoa cant rely on heritage players forever they have to pull their finger out and start producing local kids and slowly feeding them into strong domestic comps as Tongan players that will represent Tonga as the nation that gave them their start in the sport. This will take time but believe me will have a HUGE benefit on the international game in years to come... I'll predict that in 15 years Serbia will be one of the strongest nations in Europe outside of the UK.. the groundwork and player development pathway they have is constant and flourishing year on year it's not the overnight success story that naming Chris Bridge and Ben Harrison is in naming your Ireland team for a quick fix that has no prolonged impact.
The same with Canada, groundwork and marketing has put the game in the publics mind there. The interest will boom and the demand for the sport will grow, so with it the demand for on-field success. What will bring this success? A strong domestic competition and youth development system that will be properly supervised to a high level. How to manage this cost? Heck look at their attendances. Their attendances = Ticket revenue and potential sponsorship e.g. the ones they have already tied up in Universal Music (Canada) and Coors Light.
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| To be fair to Tykes/Rhinos I think there's some decent ideas in there, especially the 5 Nations comp which I think could be a goer if it were to be mid-season, it'll never work post-season.
That's some really promising crowds for Canada as well, what's the domestic game like in Canada?
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| Quote: Him "To be fair to Tykes/Rhinos I think there's some decent ideas in there, especially the 5 Nations comp which I think could be a goer if it were to be mid-season, it'll never work post-season.
That's some really promising crowds for Canada as well, what's the domestic game like in Canada?'"
Canada have two comps, one based around Toronto and he other in British Columbia, with 4 and 5 teams respectively I think. Originally they struggled to fulfil completing every game however the attendances of the internationals speaks volumes in the importance of exposing the Canadian public to our wonderful game... They're almost building from the top down in order to expand from the bottom with some exposure and money to the top again even stronger.
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| Quote: ap1717 "Canada have two comps, one based around Toronto and he other in British Columbia, with 4 and 5 teams respectively I think. Originally they struggled to fulfil completing every game however the attendances of the internationals speaks volumes in the importance of exposing the Canadian public to our wonderful game... They're almost building from the top down in order to expand from the bottom with some exposure and money to the top again even stronger.'"
That's great, there may be an opening in Canada as they seem to like their contact sports.
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9857_1341488583.jpg WEST COAST PIRATES
NRL expansion? Sometime soon, maybe......:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_9857.jpg |
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| SOO is going to pretty much kill the Int game in the Southern Hemisphere so I would concentrate on trying to get 3-4 competitive teams out of Europe. Will be interested to see the appetite for Int RL the new ARL commision has, if any. At the least I would love to see us pursue a World nines every pre season and bring back Ashes 3 match test series. We can live in hope!
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fonds noir/Buzz Lightyear.gif :fonds noir/Buzz Lightyear.gif |
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| The ARL Commission is supposedly working on rules for Origin eligibility. John Grant at least seems to understand the nonsense re someone like Kasiano devalues the Origin concept, as much as it weakens NZ. The problem is that you'll always have one state weaker than the other, and the management of that team being willing to bend the rules to get some potential star into the team. I suspect no amount of tinkering with eligibility criteria will change that.
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9857_1341488583.jpg WEST COAST PIRATES
NRL expansion? Sometime soon, maybe......:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_9857.jpg |
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| NSWRL won't let him, they need Kiwis and Fijians to keep close to Q'land!
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2244_1299706258.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_2244.jpg |
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| I'd like to see a mid-season 5 Nations in the northern Hemisphere of England, France, Wales, Scotland & Ireland. The same model as Union, 4 games league format. If we do away with the Exiles thing then I'm sure it could be fitted in.
And a mid-season 5 Nations down under of Australia, NZ, PNG, Fiji, Samoa/Tonga/CI under the same format.
Then an end of season format something along the lines of:
Year 1 - GB v NZ 3 test series
Year 2 - GB v Aus 3 test Ashes series
Year 3 - Aus v NZ 3 test series
Year 4 - World Cup
I certainly think the end of season format is do-able, and the 5 Nations in the northern hemisphere should be possible. I'd be surprised if the NRL would be happy with the league being disrupted for a southern hemisphere 5 Nations to help out the other countries but I wish they could see past the end of their noses.
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56291_1297703085.jpg [url=http://giffgaff.com/orders/affiliate/mrcarl84:3dx5x0of]Get a free sim with £5 credit![/url:3dx5x0of]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_56291.jpg |
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| All of these ideas for international expansion are pie-in-the-sky without respective domestic leagues. What is the point of trumpeting X number of international sides playing RL if only a tiny handful of the players are born outside of England, Australia, New Zealand and the Pacific Islands?
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//www.pngnrlbid.com
[quote="bUsTiNyAbALLs":9q9d2t35]Do not converse with me you filthy minded deviant.[/quote:9q9d2t35]
[quote="vastman":9q9d2t35]My rage isn't impotent luv, I'm frothing at the mouth actually.[/quote:9q9d2t35]: |
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| I’d agree with a slight change to
Year 1 GB + France tour southern hemisphere
Year 2 Four nations
Year 3 Auz, NZ and a Pac island side tour the northern hemisphere
Year 4 world cup
(the way i would structure it)With the tours being full tours once every 8 years, either SL, or the NRL start and finish the season one month earlier. If, for instance, last year had been a GB tour to Australia, SL could have started 8th of jan, or even as early with the traditional boxing day games (which would give a couple of rest weeks within the season) finishing the season on the 10th of september instead of the 8th of Oct, we could have had the bulk of squad in Aus by the 6th of sept, with the GF players coming the week after.
10th of sept is SL GF,
21st Sept GB (minus GF finalists) v one of the clubs which didnt qualify for the NRL play-offs,
24th GB V Samoa (in Samoa)
28th GB v one of the clubs eliminated from the first round of the NRL play-offs
1st Oct GB v PNG (in PNG)
5th oct GB V one of the eliminated Semi-finalists
9th Oct NRL Grand Final on stand alone weekend
12th Oct GB v Indiginous All Stars
16th Oct GB v Fiji (in Fiji)
21st Oc GB v A Pac Island select side
28th four nations starts, finishing 19th Nov.
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| The International game is expanding rapidly.
In 2000 you really couldn't find more than half a dozen countries with genuine comps - Aus, NZ, England, France, PNG and Russia - all other countries had a few halfd attempts at games and most of the teams for the 2000 WC were made up teams.
12 years later and we have genuine comps in over 20 countries, and some like Lebanon, Fiji, USA and Serbia have multiple comps.
USA have as many as five competitions - AMNRL, USARL, Jaxsonville 4 team comp, Hawiian comp and mid west development games.
In raw terms, there were less than a dozen teams outside the top 5 nations in 2000, and now there would be 500 teams in up to 30 countries.
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18302_1567366773.png [b:1crbsr9w] Toulouse for Championship in 2017, Super League in 2021!
Avignon for Championship in 2021, Super League in 2022! [/b:1crbsr9w]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_18302.png |
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| Quote: " SCOTLAND
1. Daryl Clark-Castleford
2. [sizeKevin Gordon-Gold Coast[/size
3. Joe Wardle-Huddersfield
4. James McManus-Newcastle
5. Michael Robertson-London
6. Richard Horne-Hull FC
7. Danny Brough-Huddersfield (C)
8. Chris Armit-Penrith
9. Ian Henderson-Catalans
10. Darrell Griffin-Leeds
11. Lee Gilmour-Castleford
12. Oliver Wilkes-Wakefield
13. Dale Ferguson-Huddersfield
14. Ben Fisher-Hull KR
15. Paul Jackson-Castleford
16. Jack Howieson-Sheffield
17. Sam Barlow-Halifax '"
Kevin Gordon is half Filipino (his mother). By picking him you will be depriving the Philippines of one of their stars, (along with Craig Wing, who also has a Filipino mother, and who we are waiting to play scrum half or hooker if he returns to rugby league.). Gordon at full back and Wing at scrum half, along with Gold Coast Titans Matt Srama (half Filipino, half Polish) at hooker, would be a formidable spine combination for the Philippines. The Philippines also has South Sydney's star Andrew Everingham available to play centre or wing.
By picking Gordon for Scotland you would be wrecking the prospects of rugby league in the Philippines, an especially reckless move on the eve of their big Test against Thailand in October!
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| Quote: Tyke's/Rhinos No. 1 Fan "It's clear the international game is dying on its booty. I reckon instead of playing the aussies & NZ as england, tours should be against Great Britain & Ireland, with all other games (including World Cups) played as separate nations. Also start up a proper 5 nations tournament between the home nations & france so players can be guaranteed regular international RL playing for Wales, Scotland etc. This would encourage top-level SL players to play for sides other than England, and mean games between home nations could actually be competitive, and therefore, worth watching.
Having done some digging, I've managed to come up with squads if those eligible for sides other than England played for them.
ENGLAND
1. Sam Tomkins-Wigan
2. Josh Charnley-Wigan
3. Jack Reed-Brisbane
4. Ryan Atkins-Warrington
5. Ryan Hall-Leeds
6. Kevin Sinfield-Leeds
7. Richie Myler-Warrington
8. Sam Burgess-South Sydney
9. James Roby-St Helens (C)
10. James Graham-Canterbury
11. Gareth Hock-Wigan
12. Ben Westwood-Warrington
13. Gareth Ellis-Hull FC
14. Rob Burrow-Leeds
15. Eorl Crabtree
16. Chris Hill-Warrington
17. Chris Heighington-Wests
IRELAND
1. Scott Grix-Huddersfield
2. Damien Blanch-Catalans
3. Martin Gleeson-Unattached
4. Chris Bridge-Warrington
5. Pat Richards-Wigan
6. Simon Grix-Warrington
7. Liam Finn-Featherstone
8. Kyle Amor-Wakefield
9. Michael McIlorum-Wigan
10. Paul Prescott-Wigan
11. Tyrone McCarthy-Warrington
12. Ben Harrison-Warrington
13. Sean O'Loughlin-Wigan (C)
14. Bob Beswick-Leigh
15. Eamon O'Carroll-Hull FC
16. Ryan Boyle-Salford
17. Jason Golden-London
SCOTLAND
1. Daryl Clark-Castleford
2. Kevin Gordon-Gold Coast
3. Joe Wardle-Huddersfield
4. James McManus-Newcastle
5. Michael Robertson-London
6. Richard Horne-Hull FC
7. Danny Brough-Huddersfield (C)
8. Chris Armit-Penrith
9. Ian Henderson-Catalans
10. Darrell Griffin-Leeds
11. Lee Gilmour-Castleford
12. Oliver Wilkes-Wakefield
13. Dale Ferguson-Huddersfield
14. Ben Fisher-Hull KR
15. Paul Jackson-Castleford
16. Jack Howieson-Sheffield
17. Sam Barlow-Halifax
WALES
1. Elliot Kear-Bradford
2. John Williams-Cronulla
3. Ben Pomeroy-Cronulla
4. Ryan Morgan-Paramatta
5. Rhys Williams-Warrington
6. Lee Briers-Warrington
7. Sam Williams-Canberra
8. Garreth Carvell-Warrington
9. Lloyd White-Widnes
10. Keith Mason-Huddersfield
11. Craig Kopczak-Bradford
12. Gil Dudson-Wigan
13. Ben Flower-Wigan
14. Ben Jones-North Queensland
15. Jacob Emmitt-Castleford
16. Jordan James-Salford
17. David Stagg-Canterbury Bankstown'"
Are you prepared to give up our current funding from Sports England by declaring our selves Great Britain?
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Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1 | | PLD | F | A | DIFF | PTS |
Wigan |
29 |
768 |
338 |
430 |
48 |
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Hull KR |
29 |
731 |
344 |
387 |
44 |
Warrington |
29 |
769 |
351 |
418 |
42 |
Leigh |
29 |
580 |
442 |
138 |
33 |
Salford |
28 |
556 |
561 |
-5 |
32 |
St.Helens |
28 |
618 |
411 |
207 |
30 |
|
Catalans |
27 |
475 |
427 |
48 |
30 |
Leeds |
27 |
530 |
488 |
42 |
28 |
Huddersfield |
27 |
468 |
658 |
-190 |
20 |
Castleford |
27 |
425 |
735 |
-310 |
15 |
Hull FC |
27 |
328 |
894 |
-566 |
6 |
LondonB |
27 |
317 |
916 |
-599 |
6 |
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1 | | PLD | F | A | DIFF | PTS |
Wakefield |
27 |
1032 |
275 |
757 |
52 |
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Toulouse |
26 |
765 |
388 |
377 |
37 |
Bradford |
28 |
723 |
420 |
303 |
36 |
York |
29 |
695 |
501 |
194 |
32 |
Widnes |
27 |
561 |
502 |
59 |
29 |
Featherstone |
27 |
634 |
525 |
109 |
28 |
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Sheffield |
26 |
626 |
526 |
100 |
28 |
Doncaster |
26 |
498 |
619 |
-121 |
25 |
Halifax |
26 |
509 |
650 |
-141 |
22 |
Batley |
26 |
422 |
591 |
-169 |
22 |
Swinton |
28 |
484 |
676 |
-192 |
20 |
Barrow |
25 |
442 |
720 |
-278 |
19 |
Whitehaven |
25 |
437 |
826 |
-389 |
18 |
Dewsbury |
27 |
348 |
879 |
-531 |
4 |
Hunslet |
1 |
6 |
10 |
-4 |
0 |
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