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FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Historic win could help league rival union
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Quote: Damo-Leeds "Ok so both sports have had a downturn in attendances. However football has also had a downturn in attendances along with other sports in the UK thanks to the ‘recession’.

However Rugby league can’t really afford to lose fans considering we have less than the other sports. I just think that rugby union is starting to look a lot better than rugby league. However there’s no doubt that rugby leagues Benji Marshall is the best rugby player in the world right now either code.

Its also interesting what chair maker has said about the $1billion TV deal for the NRL. I suppose it could improve things, but the French will probably always have the upper hand when it comes to playing for mega bucks. It wasn’t all that long ago that Mark Gasnier was in France.

Another interesting point is that we’ve managed to attract two promising youngsters from Union. However both codes do this all the time. But you never see people in the calibres of Mark Gasnier or SBW convert to league. Ok Gasnier has come back to league now, but that’s because he probably wanted back in league. Just like Chev Walker and Lee Smith to name a few who’ve gone there and come back.

Its all pointing Unions way at the moment and league needs to sort its act out fast.'"


get off the alcohol

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Quote: dally messenger "nz doesnt have the money to compete with us '"

So, what you are saying is tht with millions of dollars open to the NRL, uUnion players will jump ship to the NRL...and the most famous Rugby Brand in the world, the All Blacks will die off d040.gif

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The All Blacks are big in NZ.But RL is is in the same par as Union and will eventually take over union if the AB don't win the WC next year.

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Hate to be a spoilsport but anyone who believes that league will overtake union in the near future as the most popular sport in nz is living in cloud cuckoo land. Would be great but it just aint gonna happen.

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Quote: dally messenger "the fans will go where the players go.'"


Rugby League fans and Rugby Union fans will all remain the same. There won’t convert to the other code if their favourite player has. Of course there’s some fans that’ll watch both sports without wearing union or league goggles when comparing the sports..

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Quote: gutterfax "So, what you are saying is tht with millions of dollars open to the NRL, uUnion players will jump ship to the NRL...and the most famous Rugby Brand in the world, the All Blacks will die off
<spam alert>

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Quote: Damo-Leeds "Rugby League fans and Rugby Union fans will all remain the same. There won’t convert to the other code if their favourite player has. Of course there’s some fans that’ll watch both sports without wearing union or league goggles when comparing the sports..'"


nah.

last week they got 44,000 to watch the kiwis, many union fans given the warriors only average 14,000 each week

kiwis arent like other union fans, they like good running rugby

most kiwis love the nrl and the more money we have to expand there, the more people that will come over

theyll still support the all blacks but club crowds will keep falling

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Quote: Singe "Hate to be a spoilsport but anyone who believes that league will overtake union in the near future as the most popular sport in nz is living in cloud cuckoo land. Would be great but it just aint gonna happen.'"


not in the near future

but league will continue to grow whilst union has peaked and in many cases club crowds are falling

the future of NZ is the S15, a competition which is failing vs the nrl.

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Quote: dally messenger "kiwis arent like other union fans, they like good running rugby'"


If The Kiwi players are anything to go by when it comes to jumping ship (to play SOO & For Australia) then you may have a point. However to say that Kiwi’s aren’t like other union fans is ignorance at its best.

Fandom you’ll find comes in the same forms world over. There are those who are loyal to the end and there are those ‘glory supporters’.

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Quote: Damo-Leeds "If The Kiwi players are anything to go by when it comes to jumping ship (to play SOO & For Australia) then you may have a point. However to say that Kiwi’s aren’t like other union fans is ignorance at its best.

Fandom you’ll find comes in the same forms world over. There are those who are loyal to the end and there are those ‘glory supporters’.'"


which kiwi players have jumped ship?

fans will go where the best entertainment is, thats in the nrl

you need to know more about how the S15 is going to really comment here

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Quote: dally messenger "which kiwi players have jumped ship?'"


Any Kiwi player whose swapped his native country for Australia so he could play in the SOO.

Quote: dally messenger "fans will go where the best entertainment is, thats in the nrl'"


Aussie Rules Football might have something to say about that. Is that where Israel Folau went?

Lets not get into which is the best entertainment at that side of the world because attendances prove it isn’t the NRL.

Quote: dally messenger "you need to know more about how the S15 is going to really comment here.'"


I await the day when the NRL gets a South African team. It isn’t the case that I need to know whats going on - it’s the case that your denying what’s going on outside of rugby league. Coming from your mouth, rugby league is a Walter Mitty type delusion to suit your own argument.

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Quote: Dunbar "The situation you describe above where one code has a higher salary cap and therefore having the potential to prove more attractive to prospective players is exactly the same in the UK except it is Union with the higher cap than League. If the increased cap causes the talent drain from Union to League in the Southern hemisphere then is it not logical to assume that the opposite will happen here? If that is the case, then it is Rugby Union that is the biggest threat to SL being a viable competition in the UK not the NRL

In reality, neither will happen because the two are different sports and while there will always be fluctuations in power in any given region the two will both continue

As a Rugby League fan, I rest pretty easy in the knowledge that the open playing field we have these days in player movements (both amatuer and professional) is good for the sport because at the end of the day, ours is a better sport to play and watch'"


This already happens to a lesser extent, as Chrish Ashton showed at the weekend.
However the earnings potential in the NRL in the near future far exceeds that of top line union players in the UK. Who while better paid than RL players are only marginally better paid.
Its been mentioned earlier in the thread that with endorsements, that star NRL players in 2 years time may be earning $1.5million to $2million a season. Thats over a million pounds a year. No British union club can match that salary level. Infact that is getting into premier league soccer territory.

One also has to take into account the fact that union is a completely different sport.
Look at how RL back row forwards Andy Farrell and Sonny Bill Williams are classed as inside centres in Union. Ashton who was a RL fullback plays wing in Union.
Hence a player moving to union is taking a gamble on their success.
This would not be the same with a top class UK RL player moving down under to play RL.

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Quote: dally messenger "nz doesnt have the money to compete with us

in 12 months time we will be decimating their ranks

why would nz people want to watch a comp. devoid of all its good players.

the fans will go where the players go.'"


If Rl had any vision and strategy they would be priming Wellington for a team sooner rather than later. The NRL should have been taking the millions it makes from NZ TV and investing it into growing teh game in Wellington.

Quote: dally messenger "16-04-2010


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Quote: Peckerwood "Err...

rlNRL 2010 average attendance - 17,373.rl
rlSuper 14 2010 average attendance - 20,901rl

rlGuinness Premiership average attendance 2009-10 - 13,745rl
rlSuper League XV average attendance - 9,615rl

For once damo is right about the attendances.'"


That Super 14 average includes South Africa and New Zealand teams.

The aggregate in rugby league smashes union: over 3 million compared to bugger all in union.

Union crowds in Australia are nearly all down.

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Quote: Damo-Leeds "An unflattering crowd of 36,299 turned up to watch the culmination of the rugby league calendar this weekend in Brisbane, as New Zealand and Australia contested for the four nations championship. Meanwhile 80,000+ people packed into Twickenham on the same weekend to see a international rugby union friendly between England and Australia.

Rugby Union’s Super 14 attracts more fans than rugby leagues NRL down under, whilst the Guinness Premiership does likewise with super league at this side of the world. However Rugby League domestic finals do tend to have the edge over rugby union domestic finals. But off the field whenever its internationally or domestically rugby union owns rugby league pretty much every time. We might have minor victory’s over them in that department, but nothing to really shout about.

Now on the field I’m obviously going to say that league is better, but that’s only because I’m bias thanks to been born and bred rugby league. However this year has seen rugby union emerge from cow slapping to some rugby that I like. In the past I’d put rugby union down as the faster version of the very slow going American football. How times have changed thanks to rugby union looking like rugby league was many years ago before league became what it is now and union fans that I talk to agree. In recent months I’d even go as far as saying that I’ve enjoyed rugby union much more than rugby league.

If I had side step of Benji Marshal, kicking ability of Johnny Wilkinson, speed of Bryan Habana along with the leadership of Kevin Sinfield and was approaching my sixteenth birthday then I know which code of rugby I’d go for professionally once I became of age. Rugby League I’m afraid is dieing a slow painful death thanks to replacing quality with quantity. The Salary cap nature of both super league and NRL has seen talent spread out too thinly meaning that the entertainment standard has declined.

My overall view of sport is any sport is great to watch when its played by great sportsmen. I’m afraid that rugby league just doesn’t have enough great players to keep the week to week game entertaining and that shows in the declining attendances. Rugby Union on the other hand has cherry picked some of the best that league has had to offer over the last couple of years with the likes of Sonny Bill Williams, Chris Aston, Andrew Farrell and more converted to Union. Whose come over from Union to league?

In the past a hybrid game of rugby has been thrown around a few time to merge the codes together but that won’t work because a majority of league and union fans hate each others sport. I’ve witnessed this at first hand as most debates between union fans and I normally decline to my sport is better than your sport. There’s very few that I’ve come across that watch both games.

What we need is a solution that’ll see the best of both codes play each code. I’d love to see the likes of Andrew Sheridan, Toby Flood and others play for England Rugby League as I’m sure that rugby union fans would love to see some of our league stars play for their rugby union squad. Well that’s what rugby union has pretty much done with Chris Ashton, but at rugby leagues expense.

A solution that I propose is that we have an elite rugby season in England where one half of the year is rugby league and the other half is rugby union. This way the best of league get to play in union and the best of union likewise get to play in league. Then at the end of the season we’ll have play offs and the internationals of both codes pretty much the same way. Of course this’ll mean shortening domestic season’s and the amount of teams playing in the top league, but the quality will be so much better. The flexibility will see both codes enjoy each others players.

This is just a brief idea that hasn’t really been thought through. Even now I acknowledge it’ll probably take a very wealthy person indeed to see something like I’ve just mentioned materialise because people have big investments in the current structure of the two sports and this is just one complex reason why it probably won’t happen in the near future. But its about time that both codes give the fans what they deserve and that’s the best of the best at no ones expense. Days of players prioritising which code to play for should be long over because its upset either code at one point or another.

The day I see a Leeds Tykes Player playing for Leeds Rhinos in the sort of season structure that I mentioned above will be the day that Rugby will take over as the worlds number one sport. Until then we shall watch both codes compete for the best players when in reality we could co-exist together in such a better way. Surely there’s a better way than the one that is now?

Until then I shall enjoy the sinking ship that is rugby league because even though we’re sinking, I’d rather be a Rhino than a Tyke. I just don’t think that league will ever compete with Union with the way things are going. Even with more NZ sides in the NRL.'"


This is the biggest load of crap I have nearly ever read here.

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