People attack the 'rights' of a SL club to exist, but there seems to be no counter argument along the same lines that is challenged to a so called expansion team.

Namely,

'What right does a newly instituted team have to take the place of a club that is functioning satisfactorily?'

In may cases we have a well funcitoning League. Teams are improving facilities, have established decent juinor set ups and have sound business plans.

Of course there are also the fine traditions many of our clubs have - and the fact that they are woven into the fine tapestry of the Greatest game.

Any 'franchise' team should have to do it the Celtic way which starts at NL2 or 3 and works there way up. Even then there is a valid question surronding player development.

Risk and respect for exisitng teams are key.

personally i think that is the way it will go, as a european competition we are always going to get to a point where one league isnt enough and we are too big, splitting it into two divisions i.e SL1 and SL2 will still leave a lower league and be no different really to the championship,

there are pros and cons to a two tier SL, but i agree that a conference system with playoffs would be the way to go

It depends on how the Championship progresses as a stand alone competition I suppose.
We're not in the same position as football, by that I mean we can afford three or four tiers full time with great crowds. If the championship progresses like that then so be it but we need to get as many professional clubs playing at the top level as possible. With the knocks teams get in SL a 20 team straight league could well mean 38 league games (unless you use the NRL system) and a hell of a lot of travelling.
The conference system means we could keep most of the derbies, expand the competition without playing 40 odd games a year. It would also mean when one of the 'big' opposition conference sides, say Leeds travelling to Wigan, would ensure bumper crowds.
On a slightly different note I reckon it could be used as a format to bring back a SoO.

to answer that you would need to define satisfactorily

are the stadiums at Cas, Wakefield, Hull KR, and a few other satisfactory? or are they in need of improvement,

is the youth development at these clubs satisfactory or in need of improvement,

are the attendances satisfactory? The business model? the marketing? the investment? the training facilities? they match day experience?

how many of these things need to be satisfactory for a club to be judged as functioning satisfactorily? who judges the satisfactoriness of a club? is it an objective or subjective judgement? is it weighted in certain areas or a flat? who decides the weightings? are all clubs judged on the same level of satisfactoriness i.e judged against each other? or are they judged against themselves, their potential and their progress towards that?

is satisfactory enough? surely at elite level we would be wanting all clubs to excell to push the boundries? surely simply existing and meeting the basic level is disrespectful to the clubs trying to push the boundries forward, and clubs that do this are holding the game back? are clubs who simply meet a minimum level satisfactory? not in my opinion, maybe not in someone elses, maybe so

and if a club isnt satisfactory then surely it is better not only for the club looking to replace them, but the whole league that they are replaced?

the problem with the championship is, if it progresses to a point in becomes a viable SL two, with 2 full time pro leagues and p and r between the two, it stops becoming the top division of the championship and starts becoming the 2nd tier of SL, and that makes it harder to sell, it stops becoming what made it successful a viable stand alone comp, and goes back to being simply a proving ground for SL, i think a conference system is better in that it can accomodate more clubs, yet still keeps it the top level

im not sure we will ever see a return to p and r




maybe, im not sure how we could split it into east and west though with a european competition, pretty much everything on the continent is west, which would leave us with a lancashire league which included a welsh side, then everyone else

maybe a draw every year would be better,

But at this stage can we afford to destroy current clubs in our competition? Some people say there isnt the player pool for 14 teams but I disagree. While I wouldn't be rushing to make it a 20 team league I certainly feel we have the pool for 14.
Unless something major went wrong at a club I wouldn't boot them. The worst case scenario at the moment is Wakey not getting a ground but if it actually came down to that I feel they could rent from Cas.
As for Salford, while it looks slightly gloomy at the moment i'm confident they'll have it sorted in the end.
KR I feel are worth a mention. I feel they've made great strides without the massive backing some clubs have and although I'd call CP not quite there yet, they're working hard to rectify that.

If the championship became a viable competition you'd still have the Elite clubs in SL. I refer to the clubs you talked about in your previous posts as not being Satisfactory, those clubs wouldn't make the cut and the top 12 or so would.
I'd have the boundary being the Penines pretty much. Or literally the conferences so it would be an all star game between the two.
FWIW I was just providin a slightly different argument, I agree with the conference system, hence why I suggested it. The RFL could reach a major crossroads in the years coming up.

This is essentially the ethos behind all you're arguing isn't it? "Screw the little guy, they don't maximise my profits". My stance revolves around avoiding disillusioning even the little guy when there's no real reason to do so, and when you continually refer to that as a "strange" way of thinking I just feel sorry for you.

But that's life and business.
The weak die, the strong survive.
Like I said though, no club should be dropped yet. We're all still weak in the grand scheme of British sport so we do need to watch each others backs

Yes I know, but when franchise criteria are in place and being met there's no 'deadwood' to cut out, is there?

we are probably at the very edges now, 14 maybe but we cant stretch it much further,

the problem we have is that Widnes are aiming to be ready for 2012, so are Toulouse, then Gateshead, Skolars and Sheffield around 2015, which means we have another 5 clubs looking to be ready for SL in 5 years time (the decision will be made in 2014 for the 2015 season) if all succeed in their plans and are ready when they aim to be, we are going to have a situation where we either expand to 16 in 2012 and 19 in 2015, which is probably too much too soon, we leave clubs who are ready in the championship which isnt a good idea, or we drop one or more of the teams in there



what would be the point in that? when space in the league is at a premium, why not consolidate here?



if Salford havent made movement on their stadium pretty soon, i think they will become manchester



they have a decent fan base, besides that they are no further on than wakefield, Cas or a few other clubs,

their problem is they are overshadowed by a much bigger neighbour, i think they are also at risk,

maybe so, i can see the benefits, but i agree, i prefer a conference format

this is sport and life for you

elite isnt for the little guy its for the elite

if all clubs were at or close or had route to being A licenses that would be the case,

The thing with Toulouse is they would be fishing from another pool, that's why I feel they will be ready come 2012.
Widnes/Leigh in 3 years time we should have the player pool to support another club, especially if they have their own youth structures in place (Franchise Criteria) that's my opinion anyway.
Personally I wouldn't be looking to expand further in '15, it's a bit of a way away so hard to tell. If two teams were to be promoted in '12, which I think they will then a current SL club MAY have to go by the wayside.
You mentioned consolidatino between the two Calder Valley clubs. Maybe, however come 2012 one might be in such a stronger position it could well be a takeover never mind a merger. I have a sneaky feeling Wakefield could be dropped depending on how off the field matters progress and many of their playing staff move across however if they can sustain themselves and pass the criteria, they stay, regardless of who's ready below unless that team proves they have their market.