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Quote: Widnes 'till i die "NottinghamTiger - This has to be the most pi$$ poor attempt at trolling i have seen from any of your accounts (Scorpions for super league/Toulouse for SL/Toulouse for Super L/rhinofox/whatever all the others were). Very poor effort.
Interesting. I have never posted here under another name (as I am sure my IP address would confirm). I'm quite happy to express my opinions and don't need to create various accounts to do so.
Seems like a bit of a trend to bracket those who have opinions as either trolls, flat-cappers or anti-expansionists. There is certainly a reluctance to accept that people can have different opinions from some posters, who simply resort to playground bickering and insults towards those who simply have a different view.

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Quote: nottinghamtiger "Would it therefore be fair if one team could select more players than the other, as this would be a competition issue ad they would all play by the same rules on the pitch?'"


No, that wouldn't be a competition issue. The rules on the pitch state that you are allowed to select a maximum of 13 players and 4 interchange players. They are the laws of the game that make a sport a sport. How you select those 17 players isn't.

You're confusing yourself.

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Quote: imwakefieldtillidie "I also think it's a fair discussion too. And it's clear that most fans think those running the game are turning the game into a joke.'"

I think it's clear that only a select few who support certain clubs that are in danger or clubs that will never be good enough to make it think it's a joke as they are too concerned at their own self interest to see that the sport is trying its best to improve itself and its clubs business-wise so that the sport can expand.

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kcab sfrawdder Luck is a combination of preparation and opportunity Just to avoid confusion Starbug is the username of Steven Pike SOMEBODY SAID that it couldn’t be done But he with a chuckle replied That “maybe it couldn’t,” but he would be one Who wouldn’t say so till he’d tried. So he buckled right in with the trace of a grin On his face. If he worried he hid it. He started to sing as he tackled the thing That couldn’t be done, and he did it!:9005.jpg



Quote: Wellsy13 "Everything has an affect indirectly onto the pitch in the end. The selection of players (i.e. quotas, etc.) is for your squad, and at the end of the day you can't play everyone in your squad in one game, so it's not on on-the-field issue. Squad building is an off-the-field issue. The laws on the pitch are the same for every club, that is what makes sport a sport. Not how you are allowed to select your team.'"


Squad/team = same thing , so how you are allowed to select them is very relevant

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kcab sfrawdder Luck is a combination of preparation and opportunity Just to avoid confusion Starbug is the username of Steven Pike SOMEBODY SAID that it couldn’t be done But he with a chuckle replied That “maybe it couldn’t,” but he would be one Who wouldn’t say so till he’d tried. So he buckled right in with the trace of a grin On his face. If he worried he hid it. He started to sing as he tackled the thing That couldn’t be done, and he did it!:9005.jpg



Quote: Wellsy13 "I think it's clear that only a select few who support certain clubs that are in danger or clubs that will never be good enough to make it think it's a joke as they are too concerned at their own self interest to see that the sport is trying its best to improve itself and its clubs business-wise so that the sport can expand.'"


And the reverse is also clear , would you not say ?

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Quote: Wellsy13 "I think it's clear that only a select few who support certain clubs that are in danger or clubs that will never be good enough to make it think it's a joke as they are too concerned at their own self interest to see that the sport is trying its best to improve itself and its clubs business-wise so that the sport can expand.'"


Maybe, it's certainly the likes of Cas and Wakefield fans who are (rightly) more concerned.
The question is - is the best way for the sport to improve itself to include a Crusaders club who cannot seem to run for a season without lurching from one problem to another? I am actually in favour of expansion (yes, really) but it has to be done properly and with a fairness to existing clubs.
And I'll also point out that if Cas don't get a franchise in 2011 there will be nobody to blame but the club themself.

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Quote: Starbug "Squad/team
The rules on the pitch state that you are allowed to select a maximum of 13 players and 4 interchange players. They are the laws of the game that make a sport a sport. How you select those 17 players isn't. That is a competition issue.

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Quote: nottinghamtiger "Maybe, it's certainly the likes of Cas and Wakefield fans who are (rightly) more concerned.
The question is - is the best way for the sport to improve itself to include a Crusaders club who cannot seem to run for a season without lurching from one problem to another? I am actually in favour of expansion (yes, really) but it has to be done properly and with a fairness to existing clubs.
And I'll also point out that if Cas don't get a franchise in 2011 there will be nobody to blame but the club themself.'"

B*llocks do you believe that. You've started a thread saying that the sport isn't credible because of this, that and the other, and now you're saying that if Cas don't get a license it's their own fault? Doesn't that make the system the sport is run in credible if there is no-one to blame? You can't make you're mind up.

The Crusaders, like a lot of things that have needed to happened in RL, need to be stuck with. They are a project. They are underpinning the development of rugby league in Wales, which in turn will not only help SL's profile but international RL's profile (so two different competitions).
Expansion will not happen if all clubs are treated the same. The expansion sides will never catch up. And that appears to be what some people want.

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Quote: Starbug "And the reverse is also clear , would you not say ?'"

What would your reverse situation be, just to clarify?

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this thread and many others like it just expose what pretty much each of us are - narrow minded bigots on completely opposite sides of the argument! I, as a flatcapper, do not trust the RFL one inch. I do not trust their strategy and I certainly do not trust their competence. None of the lot of them would survive in business as far as I can see. Others, as expansionistas, are prepared to swallow the whole lot hook, line and sinker. No matter how bad things get there will always be some semantics employed and some "clever" rhetoric to defend the indefensible.

To be honest, the right answer is somewhere in between, taking the blinkers off and judging each and every case on its merits. Some pragmatic decisions have to be taken that may be unpalatable and inconsistent but are for the good of the game in the long term. Some bad decisions are also made.

However it seems like we prefer to persist with the pantomime insults and catcalls so...as you were everybody!

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[quote="King Street Cat":1wa9s43t]Some might look at this as being harsh but I think it's fair. When are the Rugby League going to stop persisting with this fantasy expansion. If it hasn't worked by now, it never will! I'm all for reaching out to a wider audience with our game but not at the expense of historical clubs in the homelands.[/quote:1wa9s43t]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_6731.jpg



Quote: mapleyther "this thread and many others like it just expose what pretty much each of us are - narrow minded bigots on completely opposite sides of the argument! I, as a flatcapper, do not trust the RFL one inch. I do not trust their strategy and I certainly do not trust their competence. None of the lot of them would survive in business as far as I can see.'"
Except they are surviving, they have taken a loss-making company and now turn a healthy profit. Nobody has 'swollowed the whole lot', if you had read the posts then you will see that people are more than willing to point out the faults with Crusaders etc. The difference is that it is done in a constructive way, rather than simply labelling the RFL as a bunch of cheats and constantly whinging about how unfair things are. The people who seem to identify as 'flat cappers' are almost always fans of clubs that feel they may be at risk if expansion takes place, and their opinions are almost always club-motivated. It's not a case of differing sides of an argument, because one side is not neutral. If you were neutral, you would see that the RFL are generally on the right track - the implementation may not always be the best in certain areas, but the right intention is there. Unfortunately, some of those who constantly criticise the RFL do not have the game's best interests at heart, only those of their clubs.

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Quote: headhunter "Except they are surviving, they have taken a loss-making company and now turn a healthy profit. Nobody has 'swollowed the whole lot', if you had read the posts then you will see that people are more than willing to point out the faults with Crusaders etc. The difference is that it is done in a constructive way, rather than simply labelling the RFL as a bunch of cheats and constantly whinging about how unfair things are. The people who seem to identify as 'flat cappers' are almost always fans of clubs that feel they may be at risk if expansion takes place, and their opinions are almost always club-motivated. It's not a case of differing sides of an argument, because one side is not neutral. If you were neutral, you would see that the RFL are generally on the right track - the implementation may not always be the best in certain areas, but the right intention is there. Unfortunately, some of those who constantly criticise the RFL do not have the game's best interests at heart, only those of their clubs.'"


a lot of sense there but my only gripe with the RFL is it's inconsistency - it seems to treat the same situation differently depending on the club involved which then gives the idea of mistrust & shiftyness etc otherwise the bunch of old farts generally do the best for he sport IMO

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Quote: Wellsy13 "B*llocks do you believe that. You've started a thread saying that the sport isn't credible because of this, that and the other, and now you're saying that if Cas don't get a license it's their own fault? Doesn't that make the system the sport is run in credible if there is no-one to blame? You can't make you're mind up.

The Crusaders, like a lot of things that have needed to happened in RL, need to be stuck with. They are a project. They are underpinning the development of rugby league in Wales
, which in turn will not only help SL's profile but international RL's profile (so two different competitions).
Expansion will not happen if all clubs are treated the same. The expansion sides will never catch up. And that appears to be what some people want.'"



quite right but the 'project' could just as easily have taken place in the Championship 1 as in the SL - wales,or certainly a lot of it are rugby daft so it's a great market to tap into and develop - another three years in the Championship would have allowed Cru to improve their infrastructure etc and make a realistic bid now IMO

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Last edited by Ferocious Aardvark on stardate Jun 26, 3013 11:27 am, edited 48,562,867,458,300,023 times in total:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_973.gif



Quote: nottinghamtiger "But at least in this example all teams that actually competing against each other do so within identical rules and regulations.
My point is when Crusaders play Wakefield, does this constitute 'sport' as one team is allowed to to operate under different rules in terms of overseas quota players.'"


So, your "point" is that the Origin games, the World Cup, Wigan v Saints, the Challenge Cup final, the Grand Final, the Championship final, the playoffs in both hemispheres, none of this is "credible sport", because a couple extra itinerant Aussies can play for a small fledgling expansion Welsh club, in a country with no unattached SL standard RL players.

Is THAT your point?

Just wow.

tb
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[b:34xc0vwf]Doubt everything, even this[/b:34xc0vwf]:1357.jpg



Quote: nottinghamtiger "But at least in this example all teams that actually competing against each other do so within identical rules and regulations.
My point is when Hull KR play Wakefield, does this constitute 'sport' as one team is allowed to to operate under different rules in terms of overseas quota players.'"


edited for broader context etc

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