FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Shock on the cards? |
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icons077e_files/5845-54zedonite-msnicons.jpg :icons077e_files/5845-54zedonite-msnicons.jpg |
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| Quote: The Avenger "Suspected Broken Jaw
Broken Nose
Teeth knocked out
but hey, he'd already knocked on so its OK'"
If he catches the ball cleanly, that tackle wraps him up quite nicely.
As he knocked on, he drops his head trying to gather the ball. The tackler has a split second to pull out - sadly he's not super human so is unable to do so.
An unfortunate accident. No card necessary.
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9005.jpg kcab sfrawdder
Luck is a combination of preparation and opportunity
Just to avoid confusion Starbug is the username of Steven Pike
SOMEBODY SAID that it couldn’t be done
But he with a chuckle replied
That “maybe it couldn’t,” but he would be one
Who wouldn’t say so till he’d tried.
So he buckled right in with the trace of a grin
On his face. If he worried he hid it.
He started to sing as he tackled the thing
That couldn’t be done, and he did it!:9005.jpg |
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| Quote: The Avenger "and when they do the culprit should be punished, be that by a penalty, Red Card or being cited and banned after the fact.
Contact with the head is illegal, the burden of care lays with the defender and the attacking player falling, bending, stooping or any other 'ing' is only a mitigating factor.'"
YES, AND THE VIDEO TEAM OBVIOUSLY CONCLUDED THAT RUSSELS BODY POSITION WAS A MITIGATING FACTOR
DERRR
no point carrying on this little discussion, I'l let you have the final word
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72289_1398805144.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_72289.jpg |
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| Quote: Starbug "YES, AND THE VIDEO TEAM OBVIOUSLY CONCLUDED THAT RUSSELS BODY POSITION WAS A MITIGATING FACTOR
DERRR
no point carrying on this little discussion, I'l let you have the final word'"
Thanks, I'll have it then.
It mitigates the punishment it doesn't remove it!
No need to be condescending about it, can't you just have a sensible discussion without resorting to little schoolgirl behaviour
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12389.gif :12389.gif |
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| Quote: The Avenger "You need to go away, read and learn the rules, when two incidents occur it is the more serious one which takes precedence. While it's plain to see that Russell has lost the ball forward there is heavy contact by MLs shoulder to MRs jaw and cheekbone. Therefore it's a penalty for contact to the head, what's so hard to understand?
Don't give me that MR was falling, stooping because that is only a mitigating factor, it's the tacklers responsibility to avoid contact above the shoulder.
No intent on behalf of ML, but the correct decision was a penalty.'"
Strange then, that no official saw fit to call foul play. The referee didn't see it that way, he called the linesman on who agreed, and the video ref reviewed it and saw similar. Cummings agreed.
Lieuluai did nothing wrong. He even went low himself, nothing wrong with his technique. However, the fact Russell had knocked-on and was lunging forward for the ball meant neither player was able to time the collision correctly. You even see Lieuluai realise, as Russell moves forward reaching for the ball, that the collision is coming too quickly and he turns his head just prior to impact. Regardless, no intent, no foul play.
There isn't always blame, and just because there's been a nasty collision and injury doesn't necessarily mean the tackler was reckless or negligent in their duty of care. Sometimes it's nothing more than a consequence of big, powerful men trying to flatten one another at high speed.
Yes, contact to the head - clearly, I think we all saw that - but for me Russell lunging forward in is the main reason for the clumsy collision. The officials clearly agreed. Nothing to penalise, pure accident, knock-on is the call.
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72289_1398805144.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_72289.jpg |
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| Quote: Cronus "Strange then, that no official saw fit to call foul play. The referee didn't see it that way, he called the linesman on who agreed, and the video ref reviewed it and saw similar. Cummings agreed.
Lieuluai did nothing wrong. He even went low himself, nothing wrong with his technique. However, the fact Russell had knocked-on and was lunging forward for the ball meant neither player was able to time the collision correctly. You even see Lieuluai realise, as Russell moves forward reaching for the ball, that the collision is coming too quickly and he turns his head just prior to impact. Regardless, no intent, no foul play.
There isn't always blame, and just because there's been a nasty collision and injury doesn't necessarily mean the tackler was reckless or negligent in their duty of care. Sometimes it's nothing more than a consequence of big, powerful men trying to flatten one another at high speed.
Yes, contact to the head - clearly, I think we all saw that - but for me Russell lunging forward in is the main reason for the clumsy collision. The officials clearly agreed. Nothing to penalise, pure accident, knock-on is the call.'"
Nothing wrong with your argument but we see it differently, despite the match officials not penalising it the coming days will tell us whether Lieuluai has a case to answer or not.
For what it's worth, and I've stated this a few times already, I don't think that Lieuluai had any intent to commit a foul.
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12389.gif :12389.gif |
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| Quote: The Avenger "Nothing wrong with your argument but we see it differently, despite the match officials not penalising it the coming days will tell us whether Lieuluai has a case to answer or not.
For what it's worth, and I've stated this a few times already, I don't think that Lieuluai had any intent to commit a foul.'"
Despite what I've said I would be amazed if the RFL took no action. I expect they'll warn him over his technique, or possibly a token punishment for the fact the impact was to the head. Even though I don't think Lieuluai did anything wrong, it was still a bad collision and they'll probably conclude he could have done more to avoid it.
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| well at least his injuries aren't as bad as first thought.
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Did you get rid of all the voices in your head? Do you now miss them and the things that they said?: |
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| Quote: Starbug "I have seen players sustain exactly those injuries making a tackle, does that mean they have been fouled?'"
You really are special aren't you?
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| Quote: Cronus "Strange then, that no official saw fit to call foul play. The referee didn't see it that way, he called the linesman on who agreed, and the video ref reviewed it and saw similar. Cummings agreed.
Yes, contact to the head - clearly, I think we all saw that.... The officials clearly agreed. Nothing to penalise, pure accident, knock-on is the call.'"
See this is the issue, the ref's mic clearly picked up him saying "shoulder to shoulder, no contact to the head, it's a knock on". Well you only need to view it once to realise that there definitely was contact to the head, and that can be further proved by the injuries sustained.
Regardless of whether the head was directly attacked (it was) any tackle that results in a player knocked out cold before he hits the floor, and needing a stretcher with a neck brace and an oxygen mask cannot be legal in this game. I hate the current shoulder charge rule as much as the next man, and I certainly don't want us to lose the last bit of biff in the game, but that incident was a straight red any day of the week - especially after 2 similar incidents have resulted in straight reds in the past few weeks
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Darlings of Super League: |
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| I agree with Wigan fans: Russell should get a short ban and letter about his technique for the temerity of keeping his eyes on the ball while an innocent opponent is trying to him.
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| Quote: Roy Haggerty "Most tackles involve attempting to hit the opposing player at high speed. That's what rugby league players do. That distinction is false.
I absolutely understand Warrington fans feeling aggrieved at what's happened to Russell, who would have been a key player in their push on Old Trafford, but let's not try to create a drama where there is none. It was tackle which connected with the head carelessly, not a deliberate attack to the head. I'll be honest, until I saw the replay from the angle Carney and Wells showed after the game, I thought Thaler got it spot on, as it was very difficult to see any direct head contact from the angles shown, and at full speed. I thought the knock-out was due to his head hitting the floor after the impact. But clearly, direct impact on the head did take place. He'll get charged with a careless high tackle, of the sort which does take place in every game, but which - thankfully - doesn't usually have such awful consequences.
Let's put the pitchforks away. RL is a high-speed collision sport, and occasionally those collisions go wrong. It doesn't mean the players are actively trying to seriously injure each other every time someone gets hurt.'"
Russell wasn't in possession when he got smashed. There was direct contact with the head. If Moon & Walmsley a send off, so was that. And so was Flynn.
If you look at the hit Webster took when I think it was Soliola caught him full in the face with his shoulder. Under the contact to the head rules, that was also a send off.
The inconsistency in the use of video refs is concerning. Both the Moon & Walmsley send offs were looked at several times by the VR, but Thaler chose not to.
There's also the issue of what should have been a try to Widnes following the hit on Russell. The decision was knock on against warrington. That meant it was free play to Widnes & they appeared to score off it. A fundamental error from the officials not to check this.
Ganson & Child awarding the Flynn try was so utterly shocking an error, you have to seriously question the competence & integrity of these people.
I find Cummings interjections in commentary to be laughable most of the time. Makes the game look stupid & reveals just what a pathetic agenda he had in place when in charge of the match officials department.
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| Quote: Cronus "Strange then, that no official saw fit to call foul play. The referee didn't see it that way, he called the linesman on who agreed, and the video ref reviewed it and saw similar. Cummings agreed.
Lieuluai did nothing wrong. He even went low himself, nothing wrong with his technique. However, the fact Russell had knocked-on and was lunging forward for the ball meant neither player was able to time the collision correctly. You even see Lieuluai realise, as Russell moves forward reaching for the ball, that the collision is coming too quickly and he turns his head just prior to impact. Regardless, no intent, no foul play.
There isn't always blame, and just because there's been a nasty collision and injury doesn't necessarily mean the tackler was reckless or negligent in their duty of care. Sometimes it's nothing more than a consequence of big, powerful men trying to flatten one another at high speed.
Yes, contact to the head - clearly, I think we all saw that - but for me Russell lunging forward in is the main reason for the clumsy collision. The officials clearly agreed. Nothing to penalise, pure accident, knock-on is the call.'"
The VR was not asked to review it by Thaler. Leuluai had a responsibility to make sure he did not smash a player not in possession of the ball. He should have gone for the ball, not the man who didn't have it.
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| Quote: LeagueDweeb "The VR was not asked to review it by Thaler. Leuluai had a responsibility to make sure he did not smash a player not in possession of the ball. He should have gone for the ball, not the man who didn't have it.'"
Having spoken to the touch judge and got his opinion Thaler was heard speaking to the VR through his mouthpiece to get his opinion and then commenting on the VR's opinion of the incident afterwards (repeating back what the VR had said to him to confirm the opinion) before he announced his decision on action to be taken to the players. It didn't show replays on the big screen but he did get the VR to look at the incident and ask for his verdict.
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| Quote: wiganermike "Having spoken to the touch judge and got his opinion Thaler was heard speaking to the VR through his mouthpiece to get his opinion and then commenting on the VR's opinion of the incident afterwards (repeating back what the VR had said to him to confirm the opinion) before he announced his decision on action to be taken to the players. It didn't show replays on the big screen but he did get the VR to look at the incident and ask for his verdict.'"
I don't agree at all that this is what happened. The VR's didn't review the footage & offer an opinion.
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[url:33s610on]https://twitter.com/#!/Robbo_Wigan[/url:33s610on]: |
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| The whole Russell didn't have possession of the ball argument is a bit of a silly one. It's nothing like the Walmsley one, it wasn't a late shot. In slow motion it will look bad but at full speed, had Russell caught that ball it would have been a brilliant tackle. Unfortunately Russell knocked on and there was no way in hell Leuluai had time to pull out of that. Of course I'm not blaming Russell before the Anti Wigan brigade jump down my throat. I hope Russell has a speedy recovery but there was absolutely no intent in that at all. I think it's more of an unfortunate accident than anything else.
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