FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Nigel Wood and the Bulls |
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| Quote: Ferocious Aardvark "...snip...'"
We agree on one thing - I have no idea who Awford is.
Whilst the Bulls were holding Orfords registration they had the ability to negotiate. They gave that away for nothing.
What you are say is that the Bulls paid Orford severance pay for him breaking his contract. That I seriously doubt. I would put it to you that the Bulls stopped paying their marque halfback as it started to become clear he had no intention of returning and the monies referred are infact salary payments which were withheld - that's how it reads to me and that would be appropriate for the situation the Bulls found themselves in.
Onto the fault of recruitment/youth:
At that time the Bulls had recruitment policy of big name, big expense signings such as Orford in preference over blooding their own talent. That policy had to have been defined somewhere by someone. Bulls have lost some great local talent by pushing Aussies infront of their fans to the detriment of the long term development of a production line. Im not saying the Bulls are alone on this front. as the old adage implies, Bulls bought in Fish rather than the Fishing Rod. But as is now apparent, there wasnt a long term plan.
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International Star | 3213 | |
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Sep 2012 | 12 years | |
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68505_1605979550.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_68505.jpg |
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| Quote: Wadski "
Onto the fault of recruitment/youth
Name one home grown player Bradford have lost due to pushing Aussies in front of their fans
Over the last few years, the biggest home grown names have been lost for the following reasons:
Sam Burgess: Woo'd by a Hollywood celeb to come play in the NRL.
Tom and George Burgess: Followed their brothers down under
Whitehead: Questionable reasons for leaving, mostly to do with his agent stiring the pot
Bateman: Sold out from under the club by a disreputable git
Kopczak: Illegally tapped up by Huddersfield
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Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 5214 | No Team Selected |
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Aug 2006 | 18 years | |
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27476.gif I am the hash browns of rlfans :27476.gif |
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| Quote: roofaldo2 "Name one home grown player Bradford have lost due to pushing Aussies in front of their fans
Over the last few years, the biggest home grown names have been lost for the following reasons
So you've produced what 4 players in 10 years? If you took the Matt Orford money, and invested it in youth development - dont you think that number might be higher?
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869_1597404840.jpg //www.twitter.com/pumpetypump:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_869.jpg |
Moderator
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| Quote: Magic Superbeetle "So you've produced what 4 players in 10 years? If you took the Matt Orford money, and invested it in youth development - dont you think that number might be higher?'"
Well he lists 6 but in any case he didn't say Bradford have only produced the above mentioned players. Of the young lads coming from the junior set-up, those are the highest profile people to move on.
But in any case we were losing young uns even when we were doing ok. I can think of Chris Bridge, Ryan Atkins etc off the top of my head as fairly young lads that have moved on and done good. And now Warrington are being kind enough to lend us back some of theirs in our hours of need.
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Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 5214 | No Team Selected |
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Aug 2006 | 18 years | |
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27476.gif I am the hash browns of rlfans :27476.gif |
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| Quote: Pumpetypump "Well he lists 6 but in any case he didn't say Bradford have only produced the above mentioned players. Of the young lads coming from the junior set-up, those are the highest profile people to move on.
But in any case we were losing young uns even when we were doing ok. I can think of Chris Bridge, Ryan Atkins etc off the top of my head as fairly young lads that have moved on and done good. And now Warrington are being kind enough to lend us back some of theirs in our hours of need.
According to wiki George burgess never played for Bradford, I (wrongly) assumed it was the same case for Tom, turns out I was wrong, taking the count to 5
It's still an interesting point, had you produced more/ retained better the top youth players, would the crowds have come as if they were the marquee signings apparently required to validate the Bradford business plan?
How many marquee signings do you need to sacrifice for a first rate youth production line? Would it of saved Bradford? Or would it have merely turned you into a selling club? Surviving on transfer fees for the production of more players to sell
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International Chairman | 6820 | No Team Selected |
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Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
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86.jpg Let all the doubters keep doubting and those who believe keep believing.
We’re only interested in those in the bubble. Anyone who wants to come in the bubble, you can come in.
But you’ve got to keep believing.:86.jpg |
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| Quote: Cripesginger "1. On July 26th 2011 the Bulls were granted a B license after the RFL + KPMG had done a detailed analysis of the club and its finances.'" I like how you've deliberately conflated Grade B and the finances. The financial element of the licencing process was only one part of it. The report even noted that there were some challenges, but the club, overall, was a B based on that, as one of a number of criteria.
The licencing process overall was not a financial audit, nor anything like a financial audit. It was an assessment of who were the 14 best clubs based on a bunch of criteria. Even with financial challenges, few doubted then that the Bulls were one of the top 14 - or, indeed, the top 10. Hell, I'd probably still make that analysis today given the dross and drivel, to borrow a phrase, cluttering up the bottom of the league.
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Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 20966 | No Team Selected |
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Aug 2003 | 21 years | |
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6679_1399761959.png [quote="dally messenger":1gysl9ow]was watching an nfl doco. on one of their teams and they used the term bomb to describe those long high passes from quaterback to running back and i think gibson took that idea, realized you cant throw the ball forward in RL and adapted it to a "bomb" kick we have[/quote:1gysl9ow]
[quote="eels fan":1gysl9ow]You poor poor obsessed fat ex vichyballin potato thieving stoaway.[/quote:1gysl9ow]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_6679.png |
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| Whitcuts office has been cleared out and they found these.....
...explains a lot!
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869_1597404840.jpg //www.twitter.com/pumpetypump:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_869.jpg |
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| Well I tend to find myself looking at Leeds for inspiration #cough, splutter#. They have a fantastic youth structure and it seems that once that structure reaches a critical mass, it not only populates your first team but actually generates a surplus. Leeds can now offload young talent that many of us would be delighted with (Mcshane etc?).
We were years behind Wigan, Saints and Leeds in terms of creating these youth set-ups but I did think we were beginning the catch-up. Sadly upheaval at the club tends to set this back because staff are diverted or made redundant and local amateurs look elsewhere for security.
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Jan 2012 | 13 years | |
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| Quote: MjM "I like how you've deliberately conflated Grade B and the finances. The financial element of the licencing process was only one part of it. The report even noted that there were some challenges, but the club, overall, was a B based on that, as one of a number of criteria.
The licencing process overall was not a financial audit, nor anything like a financial audit. It was an assessment of who were the 14 best clubs based on a bunch of criteria. Even with financial challenges, few doubted then that the Bulls were one of the top 14 - or, indeed, the top 10. Hell, I'd probably still make that analysis today given the dross and drivel, to borrow a phrase, cluttering up the bottom of the league.'"
It is hardly 'conflating' as a substantial part of the license process is an evaluation of finances. It has been both times and also the time the Bulls were checked half way through 2013. That is one of the reasons that KPMG are involved.
Unfortunately the RFL and their assistants have been dire when checking club finances.
Getting a license in July 2012 and then seeking several sky advances from Sept shows the rfl checks were inept. Buying a ground In January and then having the sole tenant begging for £1m in March also shows the RFL to be severely lacking.
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Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
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86.jpg Let all the doubters keep doubting and those who believe keep believing.
We’re only interested in those in the bubble. Anyone who wants to come in the bubble, you can come in.
But you’ve got to keep believing.:86.jpg |
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| Quote: Cripesginger "It is hardly 'conflating' as a substantial part of the license process is an evaluation of finances. It has been both times and also the time the Bulls were checked half way through 2013. That is one of the reasons that KPMG are involved.
Unfortunately the RFL and their assistants have been dire when checking club finances.
Getting a license in July 2012 and then seeking several sky advances from Sept shows the rfl checks were inept. Buying a ground In January and then having the sole tenant begging for £1m in March also shows the RFL to be severely lacking.'" Finances were but one of five criteria - and not the deciding one by any means.
A firm like KPMG is able to independently review both financial and non-financial information - their review was not for the finance side alone. Given you seem to think that, if financially in trouble, a club wouldn't get a licence, I can see how you can misunderstand the Bulls' subsequent problems as being indicative of a failure of the licencing system.
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//www.pngnrlbid.com
[quote="bUsTiNyAbALLs":9q9d2t35]Do not converse with me you filthy minded deviant.[/quote:9q9d2t35]
[quote="vastman":9q9d2t35]My rage isn't impotent luv, I'm frothing at the mouth actually.[/quote:9q9d2t35]: |
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| Quote: Cripesginger "It is hardly 'conflating' as a substantial part of the license process is an evaluation of finances. It has been both times and also the time the Bulls were checked half way through 2013. That is one of the reasons that KPMG are involved.
Unfortunately the RFL and their assistants have been dire when checking club finances.
Getting a license in July 2012 and then seeking several sky advances from Sept shows the rfl checks were inept. Buying a ground In January and then having the sole tenant begging for £1m in March also shows the RFL to be severely lacking.'"
You do know that Bradford weren't the only club to receive an advance that offseason don't you?
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33809_1522680904.png 'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_33809.png |
Moderator
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| Quote: SmokeyTA "I would like the RFL to help all clubs as best they can. Like they helped Bradford, Like they helped Rochdale, Like they helped Keighley, Like they helped Huddersfield when they merged Sheffield. That is exactly the role a governing body should play. If they don’t we can scrap the governing body and simply have a receptionist doing the admin, and ref to handle disciplinary.'"
I disagree. There's no point being bloody minded and forcing a club over the edge, for the sake of not giving them a couple of weeks advance. But they went beyond that.
If the governing body of this country helped out Sainsbury's, then Tesco, Asda and Mick and Ange who run the little local convenience shop would play merry hell. If you help one, you have to help them all or you're distorting the system.
Also ultimately their efforts failed. Or rather were wasted. Fair enough, Bradford made it through the season and have lived to fight another day, which is great. But as a newco, so buying the Odsal lease and all the fundraising was for naught. Now to have made it clear they'd accept a newco earlier would have been controversial, and this is being wise with hindsight, but it'd have avoided a lot of wasted cash and effort. Plus we've had to bin off licensing. With hindsight they made an enormous of it all and it has been a great advert for a less interventionist approach, moving forward.
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6679_1399761959.png [quote="dally messenger":1gysl9ow]was watching an nfl doco. on one of their teams and they used the term bomb to describe those long high passes from quaterback to running back and i think gibson took that idea, realized you cant throw the ball forward in RL and adapted it to a "bomb" kick we have[/quote:1gysl9ow]
[quote="eels fan":1gysl9ow]You poor poor obsessed fat ex vichyballin potato thieving stoaway.[/quote:1gysl9ow]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_6679.png |
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| Quote: SmokeyTA "You do know that Bradford weren't the only club to receive an advance that offseason don't you?'"
but they were the only one to receive it and then return begging for more, then more again still without cutting their cloth accordingly.
At least in soccer Leeds United got it over and done with quickly.....if the Bulls were real Bulls, the RSPCA would have stepped in with a shotgun by now
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6679_1399761959.png [quote="dally messenger":1gysl9ow]was watching an nfl doco. on one of their teams and they used the term bomb to describe those long high passes from quaterback to running back and i think gibson took that idea, realized you cant throw the ball forward in RL and adapted it to a "bomb" kick we have[/quote:1gysl9ow]
[quote="eels fan":1gysl9ow]You poor poor obsessed fat ex vichyballin potato thieving stoaway.[/quote:1gysl9ow]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_6679.png |
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| Barman and now Bedboy are no longer the saviours of Bradford Bulls!
rlhttp://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/sport/10920109.Moore____no_longer_a_director____at_Bradford_Bulls/rl
So, removing Moore and Whitcut will in some way placate OK and his desire for re-payment? This farce has a few months to run yet methinx
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2244_1299706258.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_2244.jpg |
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| Quote: Mild Rover "
If the governing body of this country helped out Sainsbury's, then Tesco, Asda and Mick and Ange who run the little local convenience shop would play merry hell. If you help one, you have to help them all or you're distorting the system.'"
The government assists certain businesses and industries regularly. Either through tax breaks or government grants to incentivise the behaviour they want to see, or through direct assistance when a significant company is in dire need.
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