The definition of obscure here is "not known to many people" so somehow your excusing the 1,000 crowds on the basis they didn't know where the ground was.

It's far more likely they may have had to pay to get in and didn't fancy it, it also looks very much like Toulouse may not have been not telling the truth about the crowd at at that TWP game which is a tactic TWP use regularly to pretend they are glamorous and people are falling over themselves at $$200 a ticket to see them. That tactic could not work against English clubs whose fans visiting Toulouse have commented that the crowds on the day were nowhere near the published crowds. When playing TWP there's no away fans to be witness to the poor crowds.

I think I know where they went wrong! They didn't put a free entry wine festival on .

Shouldn't that read could get promoted by the end of the year Walter, that would make the rest of your sentence but the end of 2021 at the latest much more credible, apologies in advance for any grammatical errors.

The promotion issue is interesting Wayne. Superleague wanted to block TWP's promotion as they don't want them, nor do the bulk of fans here, but the current TV contract is based on a system that requires promotion and relegation to happen through the MPG game. That system is contractual, and all clubs signed up to accept it after it was voted for 7-6 by SL clubs. If Toulouse were to win the MPG at the end of this year then contractually and legally they would enter Superleague 2021.

The SL clubs clearly want Mr. Beaumont to back Leigh this year so they will go up and we won't have another useless overseas club that has few fans, develops no SL quality players and won't get us a French TV deal. Beaumont hung back last season but will be all out to get Leigh promoted rather than TO with the blessing of SL bosses. If not a quarter of Superleague could be non English, non productive in terms of developing players, and blocking clubs SKY and their viewers would prefer to be on TV like Leigh, Bradford and Widnes. This is a horrible mess caused by the war between RFL and SL at the last TV contract. The RFL have now being squashed/ruined and 2022 Superleague will be fully in charge. They will seek to satisfy SKY with as English a league as they can, which is what SKY want, and this may even mean the end for Les Catalans if that league is only 10 clubs on a reduced contract value.

Again check on TWP's recruitment, all they've really done is sign up the same team for this year and next if they stay up, and hidden that by the marquee signing, Check out Ottawa and New York both postponing entry to the RFL. Neither doing anything to develop their clubs. Maybe check out Toulouse coming clean on their actual attendances.

I’m surprised you know what evidence means.

I look forward to you countering his opinion with one of your own instead of trying to disrupt any meaningful debate on here regarding Toronto or any other pie in the sky expansion club, at least Donnyman puts forward explanations why in his opinion it won't work, whereas you and Walter refuse to debate the subject and simply use it as an excuse to use it as an exercise to practice your less than subtle wind up techniques.

The fact I am questioning him is exactly what debate means lol

would that be dr jean-claude romand

The fact you are questioning him simply means you don't agree with him, either that or your just doing your normal thing on here by trying to wind people up, I or anyone else on here have yet to hear you offer any credible opposition to what he says, there are credible posters on here what offer alternative opinions to his, where is yours?, fortunately/unfortunately depending on peoples perception of you have yet to hear anything constructive from you lol

Steph, you and Jean tell me all sorts of lovely things about TWP, Toulouse, Catalans, Ottawa and New York. Where is the evidence for any of that hot air? All we have for New York is a limited merchandise site selling a few T shirts and bob hats off? Once they are gone all the evidence for NY is then hot air from a Huddersfield schoolteacher. Name me the board of directors and the investments they have put in at New York please??

Here's the direct quote from McManus on behalf of Superleague [i"Toronto is a team of English and antipodeans owned by a Australian, They have got to start producing players from Canada" [/i

So there is your direct quote, replied to in the press by McDermott who said they aren't producing any such players. Over to you to look his exact words up which will help you break the habit of making it up. Until you answer this there isn't any point to a debate with you.

I don't do opinions mate, I just look and read up on what the journos report and the clubs say. The journo Dave Woods asked Perez what was the point of TWP what would they bring to the game. That is on record in an interview you can look up on You Tube. Perez said they would add new players and new TV money to the game here. People should look that up and then look up McDermotts recent interviews where he admits TWP haven't achieved a single Canadian pro player or a single cent in TV money.

How clear can the facts be made before the Steph's and Jean's stop telling us Canada is the future?

If Canada is the future why is the Architect of this brave new world sat in the CEO's office at Bradford Bulls?? After all there is sooooo much work to do in Ottawa to get ready to join the leagues here What's going on here is some people hear only what they want to hear and TBF RL rags provide them with it..........

OK my turn Steph........In three years how many of the pro level North American players TWP were going to produce from grid iron conversions "pretty quickly" are now in the game and how many North American TV dollars have TWP been paid in signed contracts for the rights to show the glamorous TWP?

New TV players and new TV money was promised in return for joining the leagues here. Where is this money? Where are these players now they are in Superleague? Over to you?

The idea you knew more about Marketing than Gary Hetherington was laughable, but anyway that was just half time. 1-0 to me.

1. TWP need to add to their squad the top class college football Athletes they were going to convert "pretty quickly" to Superleague level professionals.

2. SKY is an English TV subscription channel who make nothing from overseas clubs. McManus was clear SKY need an English League for English clubs and subs. In turn SL need English fixtures as they draw bigger crowds....... Hull.v.HKR 23,002 Bradford.v.Leeds 23,373 Wigan.v.Leigh 15,699 etc.....

3-0