I agree that Sky aren't bothered about the sport or about any clubs in particular and their interest is having something to fill their schedules and generating revenue for their business.
I'm interested in your comment that Toronto "rate well" and whether this is English viewers or overseas viewers.
As for a stand alone deal in Canada (or France), I just dont get the "math", unless RL has truly been embraced by the N. American (or French) public.
Although it wont bother the advertisers, the numbers of "dodgy" sky viewers, who are paying a fraction of the full subscription could have a massive effect on our sports value to them.
I know of only one person who pays full price on Sky, with all the rest viewing "from overseas" and whilst I fully understand why people do this, it's taking $millions from Sky's pockets.

Equally though, Sky has become way too expensive, i wish Netflix would pick up RL, but they aren't really operating in that space.

Not sure how you work that one out, if your a sports fan and you take into account the different sports' on offer, maybe if you drop some of the other things like childrens tv and filums it's maybe not as expensive.

What if you dont give a monkies about overpaid football, F1 etc. Sky is a total rip off for the average RL supporter.

So the average RL fan won't watch the 3 games on offer most weeks plus the CC games and the GF, not forgetting the golf, cricket, premier league darts and the rest of the overpaid sports.

The average RL supporter I know doesn't bother much with Cricket, Darts, Golf etc. The CC games are on the BBC and a lot of rl fans couldn't give a hoot about the GF.

I wonder. If it was possible to go back to 1980s style, part time RL with its biff, fast wingers and off the cuff plays, would the paying public welcome it?

Please would you consider that the way this works is SKY show various sports on their English SKY TV channels and this attracts English PAYING subscribers to those channels, thus creating an additional income stream to add to the English companies PAYING to advertise English products? I pay my subs and I consider buying and do buy (some of) the products and services advertised. So the whole business plan and economics of it is SKY getting in advertising revenue from England and subscriptions from England.

So I pay £30 a month or whatever, and fancy a go at some of the beers that are on the adverts. I also like to watch English clubs. Maybe that's just me but a recent survey in Hull showed 80% of fans having no interest in phoney North American clubs. What they want from SKY is Hull.v.HKR and not Hull.v.Toronto and no HKR????? So you are totally wrong with respect and as far as I can work out. SKY care about English fans paying them subs and English advertisers getting English RL fans buying their English goods and services. You have to think about the income SKY would get from say 10 English clubs in Superleague against say 5 English SL clubs plus TWP, Ottawa, New York, Catalans and Toulouse in Superleague?.

I agree about "ratings" but if you chuck Cas, Wakey, Salford, Fartown and HKR out, and send their players abroad to dress up as French and North american players that's a hell of a lot of SKY subs lost and TV dishes ripped of the wall and weighed in at the scrapyard by angry fans vowing they are finished with Rugby league. You have fallen for the constant mantra that TWP are not only glamorous but attractive the world over. They have hoodwinked you my good man. Why not go to the next Hull Derby and discuss one of the Hull clubs standing down for TWP with the fans??.

Take a bodyguard with you.

Subscriptions is all SKY want. Super League the product is now in the hands of SL. The game itself is still in the pocket of the heartlands.

I see SL not closing the door,but I see the lower tiers closing it. Not sure how the SL will survive or all the expansion clubs.

There needs to be change in what form of structure would again be placed to criteria.

Who meets the grade? Who doesn’t?

The key to success is knowing the boundaries... Along with investment. Taking a tax free sum and still no development isn’t an answer.

Although it’s still an answer for the majority of clubs.

Hard to argue Donnyman

You keep making this point but surely you can comprehend that some people in this country (especially the casual or 'not yet converted' fans that the sport needs) will be attracted to watching a game by the novelty of an international club or a big name player (why else are Toronto's viewing figures quite good?)? They might then like what they see and watch some further games.

Also, Sky shows a lot of international sport; NFL for example which dominates the Sunday evening schedule and has plenty of advertising between plays, so it obviously isnt a necessity to feature English clubs. The quality of the product, and ultimately the viewing figures, are more important. It seems common sense to me that most Sky subscribers don't sign up for one programme or sport in particular but for the package as a whole and Sky will pick and chose what it adds or drops based on the value of individual programmes or sports.

You said previously that you don't work with opinions but it seems to be very much your opinion that people will end their Sky subscriptions en mass if an English team loses out to an expansion team - I'm sure a few will but to say enough will to dent Sky's bottom line is pure opinion.

You do make some decent points but you also present them in a very miopic/unbalaced way and ignore/avoid some interesing counterpoints like those made by BrameyRhino.

Indeed and they don't get them from France and they don't get them from North America so SL cannot have any less than nine English clubs in Superleague.

So how can we have a Transatlantic league let alone an Anglo-french one without ditching SKY?.

Yes I can see that some people in this country may be excited by an overseas club or a marquee player in such a club. This may mean they buy a SKY subscription. If that club takes Hull K.R's place can you see how HKR subscribers may cancel - especially if they are dumped for a guest club. You need to decide how you think the numbers would go on this? Nett loss or Nett gain in SKY subs??

As for Bramley Rhino you need to decide if you see him as a more accomplished marketing man than Gary Hetherington. He thinks he is and with respect I think he isn't? Over to you sir!
.

Why does there need to be nine English clubs? As I said they have NFL on their schedule that features zero English teams and still generates interest in this country. I don't think you've fully explained how SL becoming international will impact subscriptions beyond threats from some current rugby league fans to ditch them (many of whom will likely change their minds when faced with the choice).

Sky will look at this with no sentimentality - it will be a decision made on spreadsheets. Viewing figures and advertising revenue. If Toronto pull in decent viewers and they sell all their advertising spots they won't care about the likes of Hull KR and Wakefield even though us fans will.

You could yet be proved right and nobody will watch them but you should at least consider the alternative point of view.

Our posts crossed - fair enough, at least you have considered the alternative viewpoint in your first paragraph. As i've said before, i'm on the fence. The evidence on viewing figures so far seems promising but that was in the Championship with a regular kickoff time and almost weekly slot so i'm keen to see what happens now they slot into the Superleague schedule.