FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Prop forward is it a dying position? |
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Moderator | 1523 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2010 | 14 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2016 | Feb 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Hill
Mossop
cooper
Harrison
Taylor
griffin
Just off the top of my head
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: roofaldo2 "Yeah, but Graham and the Burgess boys aren't playing SL. That was my point, we don't have that solid prop player type coming through the ranks in this country. You could possibly argue that the NRL isn't turning them out at a good rate either as they're looking to SL for players in that position.
It maybe that you're going to see more 2nd rowers playing in the front row in future.'"
Explain what a ' Prop ' forward should look like and what skills set he should have ? , ditto a 2 nd row? , then you might have a point
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 122 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Sep 2011 | 13 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2017 | Feb 2017 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: wolfinwidnes "Hill
Mossop
cooper
Harrison
Taylor
griffin
Just off the top of my head'"
All top draw props!!! Think that might be the point!
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 1007 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Sep 2011 | 13 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Nov 2024 | Jul 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Starbug "Explain what a ' Prop ' forward should look like and what skills set he should have ? , ditto a 2 nd row? , then you might have a point'"
Props should look like and play like Kevin Ward, Andy Platt or Kelvin Skerrett.
We have nothing like these fellers today in the UK.
Mind you, we are short of class centres and half backs as well.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: fleabag "Props should look like and play like Kevin Ward, Andy Platt or Kelvin Skerrett.
We have nothing like these fellers today in the UK.
Mind you, we are short of class centres and half backs as well.'"
Expand further on that , what did those players do , that current ' props ' dont?
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 14970 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2002 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Nov 2021 | Nov 2021 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Starbug "Expand further on that , what did those players do , that current ' props ' dont?'"
Took players heads off.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 1007 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Sep 2011 | 13 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Nov 2024 | Jul 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Starbug "Expand further on that , what did those players do , that current ' props ' dont?'"
You go and do your homework ! I'm not doing it for you.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: fleabag "You go and do your homework ! I'm not doing it for you.'"
So nothing different then
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Him "Took players heads off.'"
And that didnt win us a competition either
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 197 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
May 2009 | 15 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2014 | Nov 2013 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| To a certain extent I agree with the original poster regarding out and out prop forwards. But I think these days there seems to be very few specialist players overall.
And just as you've asked for examples above... For me, the prop should always be the biggest player on the field, the one you give the ball to when you need to smash through the defence (I bet that wasn't said above because it seemed pretty obvious?). Or the big hit you want in the middle of the field, and obviously size would be an advantage. In teams in the past you knew who the props were. Even recently, say early 2000s you look at a team like Bradford, Wigan or Saints (just using these as it's easier to think of names around this time) and you'd know straight away that Anderson, Vagana, Cowie, O'Connor, Matautia and Fairleigh were the props in the team. They couldn't really play anywhere else, but their size was a great advantage.
Last season a hell of a lot of 2nd rowers were playing or at least covering at prop, looking at the same teams theres not a massive difference in the size of the props to the 2nd rowers. Now as long as you can run hard and straight and tackle well you'll be able to play prop. But that's just the way the games changed I suppose.
You could have this same debate about any position though. Most Wingers on the field have been used as a full back at some point, or at centres too in some cases. loose forwards have been put at 6. 2nd row can easily cover the centre positions, fill in at loose forward or cover prop. Props are being used as a loose forward if a bigger pack overall is wanted. stand offs at full back, players who have always been a 6 have played 7, and as long as you can pass a ball you can cover 9.
It's the game evolving, most players on the pitch now are able to cover more than one position, so the "traditional prop" that I think the original post is talking about isn't as desirable as a player that could tackle well, run hard and could cover other positions if needed.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| So far we have established that prop forwards need to be big
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 5035 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2009 | 16 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Aug 2021 | Oct 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Starbug "So far we have established that prop forwards need to be big
Craig Huby?
Should be in for a good year this time with a full pre-season unlike last year.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 33944 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Gronk! "Craig Huby?
Should be in for a good year this time with a full pre-season unlike last year.'"
Yes he's big
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 31082 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2002 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Aug 2024 | Sep 2019 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| In answer to the OP
No. Not a chance.
Some coaches like to bandy phrases like "lightweight mobile pack" but they are synonyms for "beaten pack". Just look at the Giants at the back end of last season, regularly beaten by any team with a decent set of forwards
Rugby League is still the same game I essence. The pack needs to gain dominance in the midfield to allow the halfbacks space to get the backs into space.
Note as well the consensus that props don't hit their best till their late 20s means you just don't get "young props" that often, those that are can be called exceptional.
Look at the set of props England could pick and all of them are top notch and as good as any that's gone before.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 27757 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2021 | May 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| I think it's a deeper set issue than just game development. Our players are full-time professionals now so lard diets are out of the window. Everybody is big these days and not just props.
|
|
|
|
|
|