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International Chairman | 14845 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Him="Him"The average crowd in the last season before SL was 5,516. The average crowd for the 16 seasons prior to SL was 5,578. A high of 7,301 in 88/89, a low of 4,568 in 85/86. The lowest SL average crowd was the first season, 1996, with 6,578.
Compared to an average crowd in 2012 of 10,699.'"
But the base of the game has shrunk in the North. The game is in worse shape. We are less competitive than even in 1980 at international level. So a few bankrupt clubs are getting bigger crowds and alot more bankrupt clubs are now disenfranchised and with them the future support of the game. It's an unholy mess.
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International Chairman | 14970 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote William Eve="William Eve"What have the crowds been like in the challenge cup and internationals during the SL era?'"
The Challenge Cup Final has been well attended but you're right the regular rounds and internationals have been poor. I attribute much of the poor International crowds to a lack of success, a poor and irregular international schedule, poor RFL management and short-minded clubs not helping.
The Challenge Cup, it's difficult to compare attendances since much depends on how many rounds you include. If the attendances on RL Project are correct they show that in 94/95 the average attendance was 5,871, in 2012 it was 6,488.
I think you're right that the Challenge Cup has declined in importance relative to the League and some of the crowds we see are poor, but then I think part of that is due to an increase in season ticket holders at clubs. Meaning more people are used to going to games without having to, or think about, paying. It's already paid for so they're going to go. An extra £20 for a Cup game makes people think. We see the same problem with playoff attendances. Also with the professional game (ie Division 1) drawing away in terms of playing ability from the semi-pro game (Division 2) it means there are far fewer chances of an upset.
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| Quote Dally="Dally"But the base of the game has shrunk in the North. The game is in worse shape. We are less competitive than even in 1980 at international level. So a few bankrupt clubs are getting bigger crowds and alot more bankrupt clubs are now disenfranchised and with them the future support of the game. It's an unholy mess.'"
Go back to the Sin Bin Dally, your Daily Mail wailings have no place here.
I'm unsure how the game is in worse shape or less popular despite getting bigger crowds. I think you're drastically overestimating the popularity of the game in days gone by. Lets not forget why SL was needed in the first place, because the clubs were bankrupt.
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| Quote Him="Him"Go back to the Sin Bin Dally, your Daily Mail wailings have no place here.
I'm unsure how the game is in worse shape or less popular despite getting bigger crowds. I think you're drastically overestimating the popularity of the game in days gone by. Lets not forget why SL was needed in the first place, because the clubs were bankrupt.'"
Then they were bankrupt with grounds to sell. Now they are bankrupt with no tangible assets. A huge difference.
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Club Coach | 4809 | No Team Selected |
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| Blow outs happen. People don't want to pay more than their season ticket for whatever reason.
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| Quote Dally="Dally"Then they were bankrupt with grounds to sell. Now they are bankrupt with no tangible assets. A huge difference.'"
What does that have to do with popularity?
The average crowd nearly doubled from pre-SL. I'm not sure how that is evidence of a decline in popularity from that era.
How many clubs were making profits back then? Or breaking even? Showing that they had to sell the family silver back in the "good old days" is not great evidence to show they were in better shape.
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| You're right, it's dreadful. Clearly, any side getting beaten by 70-0 in the challenge cup is just a joke, The game is on its knees. London are doomed, and we should all wear tinfoil on our heads.
Oh, hang on, what's that score in my banner ?
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International Star | 420 | Coventry Bears |
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| Unfortunately fans don't usually get to know what happens behind closed doors, as you know, but it must be hard for those forwards to put their bodies on the line, and maybe also they're overrated, I know Manly fans don't rate Bryant at all. And of course there isn't much pressure on them to put their bodies on the line, either from fans or the media.
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| Quote Roy Haggerty="Roy Haggerty"You're right, it's dreadful. Clearly, any side getting beaten by 70-0 in the challenge cup is just a joke, The game is on its knees. London are doomed, and we should all wear tinfoil on our heads.
Oh, hang on, what's that score in my banner ?'" Good point.
Lets get real Wigan have scored 130 points & conceded 20 at Craven park this season & we are 6th in the table are we to be chucked out of the league as well?
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| Quote Beverley red="Beverley red"Good point.
Lets get real Wigan have scored 130 points & conceded 20 at Craven park this season & we are 6th in the table are we to be chucked out of the league as well?'"
That sums up the state of the game. A sport is not a sport unless it is competitive. We don't have enough British players of sufficient quality to make up 2 full teams of 13 let alone 14 or more.
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| Quote Dally="Dally"That sums up the state of the game. A sport is not a sport unless it is competitive. We don't have enough British players of sufficient quality to make up 2 full teams of 13 let alone 14 or more.'"
No, the quality is at two or three clubs because they can pay them or they are there glory hunting, no one seems to mind that the premier league is a two horse race that it took 70 years for a Brit male to win at tennis, that untill recent years you could get all the succsessfull Brit golfers in a telephone box at the same time.
My thought's for what they are worth is that we have tinkered with the rules of the sport in the name of progress but in the prosses to speed up play have taken out nearly all competition for the ball a copy book tackle is not rewarded as the tackled player can't be held down (is not penalised for diving to the ground which is a voulantry tackle! but he can move off the mark not play it correctly with impunity) players are happy to let the ball out of play as they know there is no chance of loosing it a scrum or they will just be allowed to tap it & go. It also results in teams being able to get totaly on top & blow teams off the park as happened yesterday.
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| Quote Beverley red="Beverley red"No, the quality is at two or three clubs because they can pay them or they are there glory hunting, no one seems to mind that the premier league is a two horse race that it took 70 years for a Brit male to win at tennis, that untill recent years you could get all the succsessfull Brit golfers in a telephone box at the same time.
My thought's for what they are worth is that we have tinkered with the rules of the sport in the name of progress but in the prosses to speed up play have taken out nearly all competition for the ball a copy book tackle is not rewarded as the tackled player can't be held down (is not penalised for diving to the ground which is a voulantry tackle! but he can move off the mark not play it correctly with impunity) players are happy to let the ball out of play as they know there is no chance of loosing it a scrum or they will just be allowed to tap it & go. It also results in teams being able to get totaly on top & blow teams off the park as happened yesterday.'"
I agree that the rules are a big problem. They limit the number of people who can play the game at a good level and as you say lend themselves to one-sidedness.
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