Are you suggesting that the sport should wither and die ?
Without additional investment in the sport (and I'm not suggesting that Canada is the answer, far from it), the sport is going to suffer a slow lingering death.
Our inability to attract new fans toy the game of RL has been a constant for the last 50 years.
We have a better international program than 20 years ago, plus, Magic and the GF but, this is taking more cash from the same fans pockets and is just not solving the fundamental problem of RL being unable to attract new fans.

I am suggesting the sport does what it has always done best and that is to survive good sir.

In fact it survives ONLY because of the SKY TV deal. Would you like to consider where we would be had SKY or anyone else not bought the rights in 1996???

NA do not develop players or bring us TV money, France develop very few players and bring us no TV money - they likely have to go if the TV deal drops.

We are a corner shop who attracts a lot of local customers including the odd rich one, so we have to keep selling until even the locals don't want it.

That's the reality - and the problem is sending players to NA and France, and dropping clubs here for them to play in SL, will only shut the corner shop more quickly.

I'm a believer in letting people decide what they want to do and spend their money on, as long as 120K people along the M62 and SKY want to pay us money we provide the service but as for "expansion" forget it, the demand for RL is the M62, so sell to the real customers - don't sell it out to France and North America.

An argument bound to win everyone over.

Incidentally, I agree with many of your anti-TWP points. What I don't agree with is your seemingly blasé acceptance of a ten team league, a move that would result in the demise of two teams and not the one currently jeopardised by Toronto (who, if the critics are to be believed, risk meltdown at any time).

If "we" cant move the sport forward by either increasing participation and/or investment, there will, at some point, be no SL or any professional version of the game in the UK/France or N. America.
Like you, I'm no fan of the N. American experiment, which only has a future IF they can develop their own players - which is a HUGE undertaking and probably some way beyond the consortiums aims or controls.
To create junior RL with a wide enough base to support a few Pro clubs would be massive and there is little or no evidence of this even being thought about, let alone started.
However, contraction to the M62 corridor is an equally poor and short sighted option, which will inevitably lead to the demise of RL as a pro sport, as there are only 4/5 clubs that could even consider having any kind of Professional side.
I mentioned in a previous post that our best players are not actually being taken by clubs in France or N. America, they are being cherry picked by the NRL clubs and to a lesser extent Union and although there is little that the SL can do about this.

WE have to find new investment, new fans and increase the playing pool in the UK (and France) and this can only be done by increasing the games profile, retreating to "Yorkshire" and "Lancashire" just isn't the answer.

Your "corner shop" analogy may be accurate and yes, most of "our" customers are northern based but, corner shops cant afford the "product" that we are trying to sell and all of our aspirations need to be a little more ambitious than watching a glorified "pop n crisp" league sponsored by Londis or Spar, which no broadcaster in the land is going to pay to show on their TV or streaming platform.

Although I may agree with some of your sentiments, I believe that your solution would be terminal and despite my loathing of Toronto, as a "fit" for SL, I do believe that for RL, we either expand or die.

Toronto hasn't failed, yet, TO will never work, the same as Keighley getting a SL place, and there is way more RL tradition in Keighley than Toulouse.

Mate, Mr Perez said in 2016 Toronto would succeed by bringing NATV deals and new quality NA players into the game.

After he walked away 2019 McDernott came in and said to the media TWP would not be providing any NA players or NA TV deals.

Just how more "failed" can that be??

On the finances they have already lost $$Millions

Just how even more failed can that be either.

With deep respect it's a bit like saying Doncaster have not failed yet........

Thanks for your reply. I'm not here to win anyone over just try to take the emotions out of the debate and bring in the facts. I don't accept a 10 club SL, I just note that this time last year Lengegan & Co, were pitching for 2 x 10 clubs to come under Superleague control. I don't know if you remember that? I also think that if they play some of their fellow SL clubs 3 times now then they may play them all 3 times and have a 27 round SL. of 10 clubs.

The logic is if the SKY deal drops 10 clubs means the SL chairmen may not have to make up any shortfalls? I also remember way back Jamie Peacock calling for 10 clubs to ensure games are intense. OK none of this may be inspiring to us fans me included - but if the player pool is shrinking AND the SKY money is shrinking I can't see any way other than 10 English clubs. I'm just at the other end of the scale to those who think Rugby league is growing across North America and Europe and we are on the cusp of some massive commercial deals.

Whose currently jeopardised by TWP?

Thank you very much for ALL of your interesting post most of which I don't disagree with.

You believe we either expand or die but I do not see that relegating Leigh and shipping their players to play in Toronto which then doesn't result in a TV deal from Canada is in any shape or form expansion? Expansion is a bigger player pool and a bigger sponsorship/TV money pool. Even Perez said that!! So clubs like Catalans and Toronto are only "geographical" expansion and that means more travel costs and less away fans = lower gates. We need business expansion.

If say the game had taken off in London, Newcastle, Paris Perpignan and South Wales such that they produced an EXTRA 125 quality RL players that would be expansion. Say these five clubs all joined Superleague and French TV provided a TV deal bigger than their recent one with Paris on board and SKY decided to increase their TV deal on the basis of a bigger better and still good quality 16 club league, that would be expansion. But this didn't happen, we haven't expanded.......

What I would ask you to consider is that 70 years ago we had Leeds, Wigan, HKR, Salford, Wakefield, Huddersfield, St.helens, Warrington, Bradford, Widnes, Hull and Castleford as our big clubs. 70 years later they are still roughly speaking our big clubs.

We haven't really expanded at all in 70 years ....But we certainly never died as a result did we?? ..................... I would respectfully suggest "expand or die" is an empty slogan?

Yep. Is British ice hockey dead? No, IMO. Even if British RL went back to being part-time, so what IMO, we'd still have some who would be full-time players in effect, as the best would be working for the clubs and RFL in some way. And some playing in the NRL, which i assume will be full-time for many yrs to come.

Rugby league has been played in Toulouse for over 80 years. There is a rugby league tradition in Toulouse.

Have you checked recently the average number of fans who attend Toulouse home games and the average number of fans who attend Keighley home games? Go and check. And in which decade of the previous century did Keighley last attract over 6,000 to a home game? Toulouse did it in 2019. Go and check. Because like most flat cap anti expansionists you are fact free and utterly clueless.

Did you see their paltry crowd v Featherstone Rovers in the Championship Grand Final Qualifier, I doubt you even watched it, but there wasn't even 2K on.
I have nothing against them at all, play an exciting brand of rugby, not full of imports etc. Let's just see how it goes in 2020 for them, before you start with your propaganda about TOXIII. You never heard of Cougarmania back in Australia mate ?, early 90's Keighley got home crowds of nearly 5K in the 2nd division (championship).

It would of been their biggest ever game too poor crowd shocking stadium not worth of been in super league

BOOM.......THERE GOES ANOTHER

Which country are you pretending to be in today Walter?

It's not pretend, it's really happening, well at least in his head anyway.