Tomkins
Charnley
Watkins
Cudjoe
Hall
Chase
Widdop
Hill
Sinfield
Graham
Westwood
S. Burgess
O'Loughlin

Roby
Hock
G. Burgess
Mossop/T Burgess

For me, this is a strong side, good craft and invention from the pivots, Sinfield can control the game from 9. And lots of power and grunt up front. Sinfield to drop back to 13 when SOL gets a spell, with Roby coming on.

Tough call on Mossop and TB. Both are good players, Mossop the steadier, but Tom the bulldozer, but without a bit of mobility.

Tomkins
Hall
Ablett
Watkins
Charnley
Widdop/Chase
Sinfield
Graham
McLlorum
Hill
Westwood
S Burgess
O'Loughlin

Roby
G Burgess
Mossop
Hock

So people are saying we should play McIlorum, purely on the basis that he's a bit aggressive? Really?

He's a very good hooker, who is raw boned, aggressive and tackles well above his weight and will get into the faces and not take a backwards step against anyone. A lot of people think that is just what England need against the Aussies to wear them down before bringing on the speed and class of Roby, I agree with them.

1. Tomkins
2. Charnley
3. Watkins
4. Cudjoe
5. Hall
6. Sinfield
7. Chase
8. Gurgess
9. Roby
10. Graham
11. Farrell
12. Westwood
13. Surgess

14. Turgess
15. Hill
16. Hock
17. Burrow

Widdop can't play 7.

dont bother trying to explain McIlorum to a saints fan, as long as Roby plays for them they will always right him off. the fact the only thing Roby does better is scoot and kick is irrelevant.

Its not just scoot and kick that Roby does better, he is a lot more creative and gets through ore work defensively than McIlorum. Stats from this season show that Roby has played 12 less games, yet has only made 5 less metres, 11 try assists to McIlorum's 3, almost doubled his offloads, given away far less penalties, and Roby averages 35 tackles per game and 1 miss to McIlorum's 25 per game and 4 misses average.

It may be my biased opinion, but Roby is by far a better all round hooker than McIlorum. McIlorum is fiery and has aggression which I like and wouldnt deny he was a very good player, but to say he is as good as Roby (or that there is only scooting and kicking where Roby is better) is a bit of a joke imo. I would also class Lunt as better than McIlorum currently but that is again just my opinion

Tomkins
Charnley
Watkins
Hardaker
Hall
Widdop
Sinfield
Graham
Roby
Hill
S.Burgess
Hock
O'Loughlin

Mcllorum
Westwood
Mossop
G.Burgess

I am not 'righting' him off. I think he's a decent hooker but I would have Lunt ahead of him, or maybe even Houghton (but I think Houghton and Roby are too similar) for England - different thread I suppose.

I was just saying that the only reason I could see people giving for playing him was that McIlorum was more aggressive. Probably true, but I'm not sure why that means he should start.

Roby is a better defender and is less likely to give away penalties or get sent off. Why should it count against Roby that McIlorum hits a little bit harder than him?

If McIlorum doesn't start then I don't see the point of having him on the bench. I can understand people thinking it better to have him on from the start to get in Australian forwards faces but the starting pack that we'll be sending out will have plenty of mongrel in them without McIlorum. I'd personally prefer Roby's all round game from the off. If he needs spelling Sinfield can have a run from 9 and go with Chase off the bench.

Tomkins
Charnley
Watkins
Ablett
Hall
Widdop
Sinfield
Graham
Roby
Hill
S Burgess
Westwood
O'Loughlin

Hock
G Burgess
Mossop
Chase

What he said.

he scoots a hell of a lot more than McIlorum so really he should have better stats in all those areas, put Tomkins and Roby in the same team and roby would start to effect sam stats (in superleague). Can't measure the damage he does in defense either.

lunt and roby are effectively the same player but lunt passes out of the ruck a bit more, its been proven that if roby doesn't have a pack winning the ruck he becomes ineffective and we aren't going to be dominating the ruck against the Aussies

Neither Roby nor McIlorum should be on the bench, Niether are impact hookers. Whichever starts plays the 80 or interchanges with Burrow. For the first game against Australia I would go

Tomkins
Charnley
Watkins
Cudjoe
Hall
Chase
Sinfield
Graham
Roby
Hill
Westwood
S Burgess
O’Loughlin

G Burgess
Mossop
Ablett
Widdop

For the Ireland game which we should win easily i would give Briscoe, Hardaker Burrow, Farrell, Tom Burgess a game and rest Hall, Tomkins, S Burgess, Chase, O’Loughlin,

The Fiji game should be a real test, but one we should come through, I would try

Tomkins
Hardaker
Watkins
Cudjoe
Hall
Chase
Sinfield
Graham
Mcilorum
Mossop
Westwood
Farrell
S Burgess

Burrow
Ablett
G Burgess
Hock

To see what we looked like with Tomkins pushed forward and Hardaker moving back for a little while, See what we look like with Ablett/Watkins at centre/wing and it tests Hock against a big, rough tough pacific island side who will take no nonsense.

Then moving in to the knock out rounds, we can look at the combinations which worked best, we would have a QF against a team we would be expected to beat to bed in before the really big games start.

Roby is just a much much better player than McIlorum. He is better defensively, creatively, kicking, passing, and running. McIlorum is a tough aggressive hooker, but that aggression wont make up for the missed tackles, slower distribution, lost creativity and the kicking option we would lose.

Whenever I have watched England/GB and some of the dire performances we have put in, I have never noticed Roby stand out as being poor, he hasn’t looked out of place at international level at all.