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| Quote Deano G="Deano G":roll:
'"
Don't laugh it's true. As a kid Sam was one of those who cried for his Mum to buy him a computer game. He'd get it, costing half his Mum's benefits and he's look in the magazines for cheats about how to finish it. He's type the code in and be at the end of the game watching the cut scenes and credits. He'd sit back and smile to himself. He applied the same approach to his rugby too until recently. Why run down a field when you can take a tackle and trap a defenders arm and get Pat to kick it 50 metres down field?
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| Quote craigizzard="craigizzard"I went for Roby, narrowly from Monaghan.
It's odd but it's partly down to the naming. Man Of Steel for me implies the most important and hardest working member of a team, who also consistently plays at a high level, and who the purists know the team would be much easier to beat without. Nowadays that's invariably a 9 (T.Leuluai and Buderus also stand out, but Roby and Monaghan stand out more), or in previous years a prop like Graham or Peacock.
If it was called "Player of the Year" instead, it would be easier to vote for a fancy back like Tomkins or Chase. A winger getting MoS last year was an absolute travesty, they shouldn't even be on the ballot
'"
I see where you're coming from on the Man of Steel concept but you've picked the wrong winger. Look at his stats for last season. He wasn't just a points machine. He had a fantastic season and made a massive contribution to the team way beyond what any normal player in his position would do. Just like Roby is doing this year for Saints.
Unfortunately for Roby, Tomkins is having an even better season. He's playing rugby at a different level now from any other British player in certainly the last 10 or 15 years and possibly longer.
Fans of other clubs might not like it but the lad is just different class.
On that basis giving what is a player of the year award to any other player would be very difficult to justify.
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| Quote Saddened!="Saddened!"Don't laugh it's true. As a kid Sam was one of those who cried for his Mum to buy him a computer game. He'd get it, costing half his Mum's benefits and he's look in the magazines for cheats about how to finish it. He's type the code in and be at the end of the game watching the cut scenes and credits. He'd sit back and smile to himself. He applied the same approach to his rugby too until recently. Why run down a field when you can take a tackle and trap a defenders arm and get Pat to kick it 50 metres down field?'"
How has he scored 70 tries in 89 appearances by doing that? Did he score them all in the last 6 months?
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| Quote vikingsmurf="vikingsmurf"for me 'Man Of Steel' has always implied something beyond the normal skillfull, try scoring, flashy associations of player of the year. for me it should go to the one who literally has been Man Of Steel all season, the one who has played on when injured, worked his ass off in every regard, made the hard yards, made the tired yards, made the tackles week in week out. The one who has lead the charge without fail so to speak. in short the one who has shown 'Steel'. in that regard it has to Roby.'"
So basically you would need a seperate award for the backs.
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| Quote Saddened!="Saddened!"Don't laugh it's true. As a kid Sam was one of those who cried for his Mum to buy him a computer game. He'd get it, costing half his Mum's benefits and he's look in the magazines for cheats about how to finish it. He's type the code in and be at the end of the game watching the cut scenes and credits. He'd sit back and smile to himself. He applied the same approach to his rugby too until recently. Why run down a field when you can take a tackle and trap a defenders arm and get Pat to kick it 50 metres down field?'"
The truth is that Sam has been improving. Two years ago he was a tremendous prospect, no-one knew whether he would be a truly great player but he looked like he might develop into a first team regular and a long term player for Wigan. Last season he really arrived and went from promising young player to genuine SL star - we saw that he was a top SL player and potentially the best player in SL if he continued to develop. At the start of this season he was playing as well as Roby and Monaghan but as the season moved on he has got better and better and better. He has now left them behind and is playing rugby at a significantly higher level than anyone else in SL.
His development has been astonishing to watch, even for a Wigan fan who grew up watching the legends of the late 80s and early 90s and then saw Robinson and Farrell come through into the first team. Robinson is the nearest comparator in terms of his ability to win matches but I think Tomkins in the second half of this season has become an even better player than Robinson, which is not something I would say lightly. Robinson is an all time great of world RL. I think in time he may even eclipse Hanley as the modern era's greatest British player. It's almost blasphemy to say that but this lad is so, so good already and his potential is incredible (frightening I imagine if you're not a Wigan fan). Just how good can be become? I can't wait to find out over the next few years.
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Club Owner | 13190 | No Team Selected |
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| Heart says Chase but have to agree I think it will be Tomkins this year as he has been undoubtably the stand out player of the season.
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| Quote Odemwingie="Odemwingie"So basically you would need a seperate award for the backs.'"
i dont believe a seperate award would have to be specifically for the backs, the qualities i mentioned are not exclusive to forwards. you could also have a straight forward 'player of the year' carrying equal weight. that could be the one for the best all rounder, with the flashy skills and try scoring.
the point i was trying to make is you can be The true man of STEEL without being the best all rounder i.e. the traditional player of the year. if im making any sense? 
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| Quote Deano G="Deano G"The truth is that Sam has been improving. Two years ago he was a tremendous prospect, no-one knew whether he would be a truly great player but he looked like he might develop into a first team regular and a long term player for Wigan. Last season he really arrived and went from promising young player to genuine SL star - we saw that he was a top SL player and potentially the best player in SL if he continued to develop. At the start of this season he was playing as well as Roby and Monaghan but as the season moved on he has got better and better and better. He has now left them behind and is playing rugby at a significantly higher level than anyone else in SL.
His development has been astonishing to watch, even for a Wigan fan who grew up watching the legends of the late 80s and early 90s and then saw Robinson and Farrell come through into the first team. Robinson is the nearest comparator in terms of his ability to win matches but I think Tomkins in the second half of this season has become an even better player than Robinson, which is not something I would say lightly. Robinson is an all time great of world RL. I think in time he may even eclipse Hanley as the modern era's greatest British player. It's almost blasphemy to say that but this lad is so, so good already and his potential is incredible (frightening I imagine if you're not a Wigan fan). Just how good can be become? I can't wait to find out over the next few years.'"
I cannot disagree with your comparatives between Tomkins and the rest of Super League. It is very difficult to compare players in different positions and Roby offers a team something different to Tomkins but I think (as I have stated before) that Tomkins has been the best player in SL this year by some distance
Again comparisons between Tomkins and Farrell/Robinson are difficult as they are different positions but as an all round player Tomkins can go on and eclipse both
Where I would probably draw the line is Hanley. Any player will have to become something very very special to be compared favourably to Hanley. Unlike a lot of players from the part time era, I actually think that Hanley would be a better player in the modern era as his attributes were 100% suited to modern day rugby. In my lifetime, the Australians have absolutely dominated the sport of rugby league (not now though!!) but I would put Hanley in the top 3 players I have ever seen
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| Quote vikingsmurf="vikingsmurf"i dont believe a seperate award would have to be specifically for the backs, the qualities i mentioned are not exclusive to forwards. you could also have a straight forward 'player of the year' carrying equal weight. that could be the one for the best all rounder, with the flashy skills and try scoring.
the point i was trying to make is you can be The true man of STEEL without being the best all rounder i.e. the traditional player of the year. if im making any sense?
'"
Adrian Vowles won it once which suggests its not a 'Best player overall during that period' award, but more of a nod to a player who has done something out of the ordinary for their team.
If Sam is as good as the Goons think, then he'll win it for the next 10 years, just as the likes of Sculthorpe or Cunningham would have dominated it over the past 10 years. But it doesn't work like that.
When is it announced anyway?
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| Quote Dunbar="Dunbar"I cannot disagree with your comparatives between Tomkins and the rest of Super League. It is very difficult to compare players in different positions and Roby offers a team something different to Tomkins but I think (as I have stated before) that Tomkins has been the best player in SL this year by some distance
Again comparisons between Tomkins and Farrell/Robinson are difficult as they are different positions but as an all round player Tomkins can go on and eclipse both
Where I would probably draw the line is Hanley. Any player will have to become something very very special to be compared favourably to Hanley. Unlike a lot of players from the part time era, I actually think that Hanley would be a better player in the modern era as his attributes were 100% suited to modern day rugby. In my lifetime, the Australians have absolutely dominated the sport of rugby league (not now though!!) but I would put Hanley in the top 3 players I have ever seen'"
That's why I said it was almost blasphemy. Hanley is a rugby god. I have no doubt that he would be as good as any player in the world if he were playing now.
But... Tomkins has been absolutely amazing in the last few months and he's still getting better. I'm not saying he's reached Hanley's level yet but he is on his way to greatness. He now has an aura about him that I haven't seen a player have for a very long time. Other than Hanley and Robinson the other comparator would be Gene Miles in the second half of the season he was with us, when he forged an unbelievable partnership with Offiah. Every time big Gene got the ball something special seemed to happen. That's what Hanley had in abundance and that's what Tomkins has now. (To a lesser extent Jonathan Davies had it too.)You can see the other team start to panic when he gets the ball. It's just innate talent, like these guys were born to play rugby. They can do things that other people can't. It is incredible to watch. It is pure rugby magic.
Like I said, Tomkins development is not complete. Whether he will go on to be talked of alongside Hanley, Murphy and Boston (many Wigan fans of mature years reckon Boston was as good as and some say better than Hanley, but who can compare the games across those eras?) as an all time great remains to be seen, but he's already a sensational player and I can wait to watch him over the next few years.
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| Quote Saddened!="Saddened!"Adrian Vowles won it once which suggests its not a 'Best player overall during that period' award, but more of a nod to a player who has done something out of the ordinary for their team.'"
On the contrary, Adrian Vowels was comfortably one of the best players in the league that year, if not the best. The list of Man of Steel winners shows that you have to be a top class player to win the award and you do Vowles a disservice to suggest otherwise
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| Quote Deano G="Deano G"That's why I said it was almost blasphemy. Hanley is a rugby god. I have no doubt that he would be as good as any player in the world if he were playing now.
But... Tomkins has been absolutely amazing in the last few months and he's still getting better. I'm not saying he's reached Hanley's level yet but he is on his way to greatness. He now has an aura about him that I haven't seen a player have for a very long time. Other than Hanley and Robinson the other comparator would be Gene Miles in the second half of the season he was with us, when he forged an unbelievable partnership with Offiah. Every time big Gene got the ball something special seemed to happen. That's what Hanley had in abundance and that's what Tomkins has now. (To a lesser extent Jonathan Davies had it too.)You can see the other team start to panic when he gets the ball. It's just innate talent, like these guys were born to play rugby. They can do things that other people can't. It is incredible to watch. It is pure rugby magic.
Like I said, Tomkins development is not complete. Whether he will go on to be talked of alongside Hanley, Murphy and Boston (many Wigan fans of mature years reckon Boston was as good as and some say better than Hanley, but who can compare the games across those eras?) as an all time great remains to be seen, but he's already a sensational player and I can wait to watch him over the next few years.'"
Tomkins might someday be able to match Hanley in some elements of his play, but he will never do it while making 40 tackles a match, and, physically, he'll never be able to run or tackle with as much power as Ellery. In short, he might be outstanding, but he'll never be outstanding in so many aspects of the game.
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