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The thing is the more ' bums on seats ' you have , the easier it is to get the corporate sponsor
Having decent corporate sponsorship does not bring in ' bums on seats '
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| Quote Marto="Marto"Nope there is no muddled thinking on my part. Only incomprehension on your part.
No you're muddled. I comprehend the twee 'common ownership' models. They are a joke.
Maybe Huddersfield are a shining example of how a wealthy man can run a club for the benefit of the fans and the club and not for what he alone can get out of it. But i'm afraid he's in the minority.
Not true. these guys earn huge amounts of money. The ROI from sport is meaningless to them. Their pleasure is from their team doing well...just like most fans
Most wealthy backers, in my experience, are in it for their own benefit.
Richard Branson wasn't a fan of the broncos was he? soon scarpered when the going got tough.
He enjoyed his involvement and continued to offer financial support following his exit. Or does an owner have to commit for life? Many fans come and go.
Paul Caddick isn't a Fan of the rhinos, he is and always has been a rugby union man, but saw an opportunity when he bought into the leeds CF&A, and only serviced their debit rather than paying it off.
The guy who owned the club while they have become the most successful team in the summer era + with the biggest fan base + an excellent youth structure. Tell me you are kidding
 Is there a club + fans in the championship that would not like to see their club do as well as Leeds? Your dislike of wealthy backers has few limits.
Maybe your wealthy backer isn't so up for it, specially after allegedly transferring the giants and towns shares in the SMC to a separate company that he may or may not own.
What he does with the assets he bought and owns is his business Live with it
My own club, ended their professional life as nomads, when the wealthy backers got bored sold the ground to a shell company who then sold it on for houses. Some of these same people were involved when Hunslet sold parkside and became nomads.
Steven Vaughan who owned Widnes for a while is a shining example of been a fan of the club. Especially the way he's treating the Chester City Fans right now.
Geez, do wealthy backers have to get it right all the time? if not there is something wrong with them? Grow up. Even under Vaughn Widnes would play far better RL than Bramley and attract many more fans. Even a 'bad Vaughn' is better than some self indulgent set ups.
want me to keep going?
Fans owned clubs are the way forward, imo. That's clubs owned by the fans, run by the fans for the benefit of the fans. Following the Supporters Direct model, used in Rugby League by Ourselves and Hornets RL. With a board of directors, elected by the fans.
How lovely. Smashing that in a free market many forms of ownership may exist. I would rather watch caddicks Rhinos than Rochdale any day. So woud 15K+ RL fans.
maybe they do have a problem with wealthy people. But my guess is that they are in the main fed up with their clubs been used as the play thing of the rich, to be discarded when they are fed up with it like a spoilt kid.
No surprise that you would guess that! Or that you need to see the world in that way.
but look at football and the shenanigans there with the more than half the premiership clubs being owned by foreign nationals. Or check out [url=http://footballmanagement.wordpress.com/2009/10/14/supporters-trusts-v-benefactors/this post on Supporter Trusts Vs Benefactors[/url or check out [url=http://delicious.com/kevin.ryethis series of links[/url that show how well your wealthy benefactors are doing as fans of the clubs they own.
My wealthy benefactors?
 Careful your prejudices are showing
As i said in my post, come and have a go at running a club.
When I am rich enough I might just do so. Thanks.
[size=42**The views represented in this posts, are my views and do not represent the views of Bramley Rugby League Community Club, Bramley Buffaloes, it's committee or it's fans.[/size'" |
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| Quote Marsdengiant="Marsdengiant"blah'"
 well done son. you haven't read or comprehended anything i've said.
I counter your statement about wealthy benefactors being fans of the club and all you can do is talk about money and success they have brought. How did that make Caddick a Rhinos fan pre him buying the club. Steven Vaughan was never a fan of any of the clubs he's ruined, but why should we let that get in the way of your ideas. I can live with Ken Davy Doing what he wants. but what happens should his business empire go bust? where will that leave the giants and HTFC?
You really have no idea what you are talking about. Maybe you should apply for a job with the RFL. They could do with more people like you. possibly a job in development.
and as for your statement about twee common ownership and it been a joke. maybe you've heard of a small team called FC Barcelona? They certainly aren't a joke.
but hey ho, you stick to living in your little bubble, and i'll crack on with running my club, secure in the fact that no one person can buy or sell my club for private gain. |
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| Player Coach | 1977 | No
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| Quote Marto="Marto":CLAP:
well done son. you haven't read or comprehended anything i've said.
No sweetcheeks, I comprehend it. I just think your twee anti business and pro common ownership views are 'touching'
I counter your statement about wealthy benefactors being fans of the club and all you can do is talk about money and success they have brought. How did that make Caddick a Rhinos fan pre him buying the club. Steven Vaughan was never a fan of any of the clubs he's ruined, but why should we let that get in the way of your ideas. I can live with Ken Davy Doing what he wants. but what happens should his business empire go bust? where will that leave the giants and HTFC?
Your dislike of money and success are shining through, yet again. You might not like tens of thousands of fans watching games - I do. You might not like a top youth development system - I do. You may not like watching a good RL team - but many in Leeds love it. So Caddick doesn't fit your flat cap view of a supporters, tough.
Organisations 'go bust'. Commonly owned organisations ' go bust' It happens. Sadly some numpties have this wealthy backer = Bad idea. They are clueless.
You really have no idea what you are talking about. Maybe you should apply for a job with the RFL. They could do with more people like you. possibly a job in development.
Should I? Could they? How lovely. I love you common ownership kiddies. Often so far up themselves. They wet themselves over the odd exception like Scott Bader / Baxi /Kantega/Mondragon and fail to see how small they are in the wider business context.Needing to pretend that private business is..bad. Rarely mentioning the many commonly owned flops.Their impotent evangelising has a niave charm.
and as for your statement about twee common ownership and it been a joke. maybe you've heard of a small team called FC Barcelona? They certainly aren't a joke.
[Sorry I should have added Barcelona to the previous list. I know it is a name you common ownership Johnies like to mention. How lucky for you that barcelona (with their £Ms from free market companies
 ) are the only sport team in the world...oh wait a minute. A twee exception, but a lovely one
but hey ho, you stick to living in your little bubble, and i'll crack on with running my club, secure in the fact that no one person can buy or sell my club for private gain.
The little bubble that is the real world
You crack on with running YOUR club. Secure in the fact that it will satisfy your personal ego needs and give you periodic opportunities to rage against 'evil sugar daddies' and 'nasty RFL'.
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| Quote Starbug="Starbug"Like the suggestion I made about having 4/5 regional marketing managers each overseeing 4/5 clubs , each club to provide 1 person , giving a manager with a team working at each club one week per month , or each club 2 days a fortnight
These regional managers overseen by 1 general manager supplied directly from the RFL
All clubs could then have a team working for them on specific projects part of the time instead of probably one person working full time
The managers then along with the general manager liase with each other on what has worked at different clubs and what hasn't worked
Each club given a budget that the manager overseas , but it is only spent on ' marketing ''"
if the RFL were to do this, wouldnt this cast a huge doubt on clubs in the championships ability to run themselves as a viable business
making it much more difficult for a championship club to prove itself worthy of a franchise? |
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| Quote Starbug="Starbug"Thing is Marto , How many posters on here after having read my idea will be thinking that by ' Marketing ' I mean raising corporate and sponsorship interest , when what I really mean is fans through the turnstyles
Quite simply the 1 st step should be to double the attendances in the Championships , which shouldn't be too hard considering how bad they currently are'"
It should do both
there is no either/or situation here |
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| Player Coach | 1977 | No
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| Quote Starbug="Starbug"Thing is Marto , How many posters on here after having read my idea will be thinking that by ' Marketing ' I mean raising corporate and sponsorship interest , when what I really mean is fans through the turnstyles
Quite simply the 1 st step should be to double the attendances in the Championships , which shouldn't be too hard considering how bad they currently are'"
Shouldn't it? |
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| Quote Starbug="Starbug"So basically you advocate the Australian model of ' feeder ' clubs ?'"
Not exactley but a more integrated way of running things |
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| Quote SmokeyTA="SmokeyTA"if the RFL were to do this, wouldnt this cast a huge doubt on clubs in the championships ability to run themselves as a viable business
making it much more difficult for a championship club to prove itself worthy of a franchise?'"
Why , how many people do Quins have in their marketing dept ? , or Celtic
In fact having a think about it today as the Skolars would find it difficult to ' partner up ' you could have them arrange things with Quins and Celtic
It all comes down to money , the non SL clubs dont have any so instead of having maybe one person working on their own not really getting anywhere , you have a team working full time on marketing but ' blitzing ' one club in any given week
The people the clubs supply learn more about marketing as a result so if that club then does get into SL you have an experienced person to head up any marketing that club then does
Like ' training ' |
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| Quote SmokeyTA="SmokeyTA":vvq52b1eIt should do both
there is no either/or situation here'" , that combined with in some cases the losing of the ' holy Grail ' of SL means chasing that support is a total waste of time
Spread your resourses too thinly and you achive nothing , plus there is time in the ' off ' season to look at that side of things , and for potentially directors to be better suited to deal with it
What I am reffering to is during the season |
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| Quote Marsdengiant="Marsdengiant":n8vggvkfShouldn't it?
'" so trying to add say 10 or 20 % isn't really that much to aim at
Part of this boils down to do the RFL want the people of Dewsbury watching the Rams or do they want them at the Giants , similar with Leigh people at the LSV or would they rather they go to the DW or the HJ ? |
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| International Chairman | 21765 | No
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| Feb 2002 | 23 years | |
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| Quote Starbug="Starbug"Well lets face it they are not very good at the moment [ bit like the Giants really so trying to add say 10 or 20 % isn't really that much to aim at
Part of this boils down to do the RFL want the people of Dewsbury watching the Rams or do they want them at the Giants , similar with Leigh people at the LSV or would they rather they go to the DW or the HJ ?'"
no no you've got it all wrong. like marsdengiant says, everythings cool, Ken Davy will sort it out. nothing to worry about. |
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