FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > England vs Samoa: do or dire! |
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| Quote: loiner81 "Decent'ish kicking game but Smith can't tackle for **** and the Aussies will target him all night.
Hardaker at FB and move Tomkins into the halves with Widdop,
Drop Joel Tomkins & Westerman and we might have a chance next week.'"
Good assessment.
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| Quote: Wigg'n "Greg Inglis drops a bomb
Greg Inlis = ill
Sam Tomkins = does it at least once every big game. At international level that means starting with a 6 point handicap, which we can ill afford.
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| Quote: P-J "What part of his game is missing?
He's literally our best player.
He's a 6/7 playing 1 imo. Always has been. Can get away with it in SL because teams don't put him under pressure enough on the high bombs. I haven't watched his NRL games, but I'd suspect they're targeting him in that area. It's a weakness that he's never fixed.'"
James Graham is our best player by a country mile.
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| I'd start with Sam Tomkins on the bench. Use him as an impact / broken play runner when the big guys are tiring. Joel Tomkins should be nowhere near the 17 in my opinion. In the past we have had a glut of back rowers but its one of our weakest areas at present. Not sure why that is.
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| Quote: Fully "Surprised no one has said to drop Charnley. He was anonymous today and did sod all.
As for people criticising Shenton, two of our tries came off of him. He was the only one backing up Clark. Defensively, he was no worse than others you are all not mentioning.
Hall - 3 missed tackles, Watkins 4 missed tackles, Charnley 3 missed tackles.
Why not drop the entire backline? I'm sure there's an anti-Cas agenda on the VT and it's not surprising as per usual. Take your tinted specs off and see what he did do for England. He's been the best centre in the comp this season and deserves to be playing. You didn't want Clark and Shenton in before the comp started and now you want them removing during. Is it because it's little Cas?
Hardaker in for Tomkins, Burgess in for Charnley, O'Loughlin in for Westerman for me, Ferres in back row and one of Westerman/Whitehead on bench.'"
Persicution Complex in full bloom!
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| I'm always amazed how much time England fans spend talking down their own team and talking up the opposition.
If you're generally scared or worried by this Australian side, I can't see why. As weak an Australian side - particularly in the forwards as I can ever remember seeing.
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| I thought the forwards were fine today - good, in fact, and I'm optimistic about them clashing with the Aussies. As ever, our weakness was in the back 7. The threequarters offered little threat, but to be fair to them, they didn't get great service from the halfbacks.
I do think O'Loughlin needs to come in, almost certainly for Farrell or Joel Tomkins. But the key change for me would be to bring in Hardaker somewhere, as he is a genuinely potent attacking threat. Based on today, I'd swap him in for Shenton, but I can also see the argument of him starting at fullback with Sam Tomkins on the bench.
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| Lot of negativity here, first of all think it should be considered that this was England's first game in a year. Our world cup campaign started off with a loss in a friendly to Italy. This time we looked off the pace and still saw off a pretty strong Samoa team. Some of the guys that played today haven't played in over a month now so I'd say some rust is to be expected.
Don't think many changes need to be made, other than Westerman (who was solid) for O'loughlin. We were caught in a good arm wrestle with a powerful Samoan pack and the momentum was constantly shifting. They were kicking on the front foot quite a bit which did Tomkins no favours with those bombs. Think it's a huge overreaction to call for him to be dropped or moved after that game imo. Our forwards need to step up against a fairly vulnerable looking Australian pack and set a platform. When the kiwis went route 1 today it looked very effective. We should take some encouragement from that.
I concur with Vossy, if we can step up a gear from today, which every player in that team is capable of doing, we can turn Australia over next week. Personally I think this is shaping up to be one of the best 4 nations. Australia look vulnerable and Samoa look less likely to be swept aside than any other team outside the big 3 in any of these tournaments so far.
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| Rusty from England but thats to be expected first game up, goes without saying we need to improve for next week but we def can... Aussies up next who look in disarray!
like to see o'loughlin and whitehead come in for ferres and westerman next week.
what was with the BBC commentary today!!! it was ahead of the actual game by a few seconds..very frustrating
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| Quote: brearley84 "Rusty from England but thats to be expected first game up, goes without saying we need to improve for next week but we def can... Aussies up next who look in disarray!
like to see o'loughlin and whitehead come in for ferres and westerman next week.
what was with the BBC commentary today!!! it was ahead of the actual game by a few seconds..very frustrating
The BBC had received intelligence from Australian police that a skinny Samoan woman with very large breasts was going to climb the fence and streak naked across the field just as Sam Tomkins was trying to catch a high kick.
The BBC did not want any of the British and Samoan establishments, especially the Samoan Royal Family and Ed Miliband, to see this, and thus the video transmission was shown on delay. However it turns out that the Queensland police were able to intercept the woman before she got to the fence, and she was placed in protective custody.
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| At the end of the day if we beat Oz we get to the final and they go out. If we lose then in reality it'll be NZ v Oz. So it rides on next week. I still hold out hope for a Samoa v England final as I think Samoa may spring a surprise next week!
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| Sam Tomkins could face a video review for a leg-twist on Simona in the 53rd minute
DCE looks like he's out of the Tournement with Brisbanes Ben Hunt set to replace him at stand off
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| The only change I would make would be to bring O'Loughlin in for Westerman.
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| I think people do a disservice to Leilua who is an excellent player when commenting on Shenton's defence.
I felt Shenton did pretty well to mostly contain the most dangerous centre on display today, including the centre I think is the world's best in Whare.
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| Quote: brearley84 "Rusty from England but thats to be expected first game up, goes without saying we need to improve for next week but we def can... Aussies up next who look in disarray!
like to see o'loughlin and whitehead come in for ferres and westerman next week.
what was with the BBC commentary today!!! it was ahead of the actual game by a few seconds..very frustrating
This. I cannot understand why the outstanding back rower of the Super League season by a country mile isn't in the 17. We need Elliott Whitehead's attacking threat outwide. Thought Ferres, Westerman and Joel Tomkins created no attacking threat so any two of them three need to be replaced by O'Loughlin (who has real aggression and leadership qualities) plus Whitehead who knows where the tryline is.
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