I thought he looked dangerous with the ball and made a couple of half breaks. He's a big lad and that's valuable at this level.

Looking at the stats for the game I'd say most of the forwards were possibly under used if anything. They all seemed to get a very even share of minutes but I think you want guys like Graham and hopefully next week Lockers out there for 60 to 70 minutes. The other guys can play around them then and try and add impact.

Looking at those stats I'd say Ferres wasn't busy enough. He made 13 tackles in the game compared to Westerman and Farrell who both made 33. I could be wrong but I don't think there was a great deal of difference in the time they spent on the field either.

I said on our Hull board, Westerman was picked for this tournament on he back of having a great year at Hull where he has been playing as a ball playing loose forward. It was obvious he'd been told to play more as an extra prop. No sure he made a pads all game other than the offload that went to ground (right idea, very poor execution).
We've seen at Hull that Westy is best when he gets more a free roam and he didn't get to show it today. Widdop had to do too much by himself (hardly any help from Smith).
Still think Westy was better than Ferres even when playing a role he isn't suited to, so I'd be happy to see O'Loughlin in at 13 and Westy in the second row over Ferres.

Next week.....Ferres and Westerman to miss out for me despite the 33 tackles he made.

Both O'Loughlin and Whitehead to replace them, the first being the captain, the second being the best second rower in the country this year.

I agree with everything there apart from the bit about Smith. I'm stunned he's had a few people knock him. Without him in that second half I don't think England win the game. His kicking game was the only thing keeping the Samoans at bay at times and it also led to a couple of try's. Add in the try he set up in the first half for Watkins with a stunning ball for Tomkins and it added up to a very successful debut.

He's never going to take the line on time and again, it just isn't his game but overall I thought the pairing with Widdop had nice balance.

Id start Whitehead before Joel Tomkins and O'Loughlin if fit would be in ahead of Westerman who'd drop to the bench.

Not convinced by Shenton who looked a little lightweight at this level and was bullied by his opposite centre.

Waited until I saw both games on record bevore commenting. First point, with the players we've got. We should beat Australia next week. We should hammer them if DCE & Inglis are injured.

However I expect a comfortable OZ win.

Same every year for England. We struggle against the minnow side, the coaches say we will take the positives, and we have no momentum going into the tournament.

08 WC - lucky to beat PNG, didn't win another match all tournament.

2010 four nations - Drew with NZ Maori. Hammered by OZ and comfortably beaten by NZ.

2013 WC - lost to Italy, had a pretty poor tournament apart from an amazing performance in the semi. But still lost.

Not good enough. We're always taking the positives of scraping past a minnow before being spanked by NZ/OZ. The coach should be demanding more from his players, I don't think i have heard McNamara criticise them ever. He's a weak coach and not good enough.

On paper, we have the team to make history and stop Australia making a final. However I expect a 20+point loss and McNamara boring us to death of how Australia were a wounded animal and we know what we have to fix up to beat NZ. When we lose to NZ we'll hear about how this special group of players have a big future a head of rhem. Forget about the future. Now is our time.

On a more positive note, a large crowd in the suncorp, NZ hammering OZ, and for a neutral who may not watch RL, the Samoa match would have been enjoyable To watch.

The 17 doesn't need wholesale changes, it was a lacklustre performance but it should have hopefully blown some of the cobwebs away. England RL haven't played since the WC semi final almost 12 months ago and have had one training camp that none of the NRL based players or Wigan players could attend because it was the only time McNamara could get off from picking the cones up at Sydney Roosters. Smith and Widdop probably only met for the first time last week, let alone play together. That partnership needs time to build.

It's the same old story, one bad game and everyone's in uproar calling for square pegs in round holes. Move Tomkins to a position he hasn't played for over 4 years. Put props at LF and move Lockers to 2nd row. It's nonsense tbh. The only changes I'd make would be Lockers for Westermand and posssibly Whitehead for Ferres. Before today's game I wanted Hardaker in over Shenton and would still like to see that, because I think he's a better player rather than a knee jerk reaction.

McNamara should have gone after the WC. Today might not have been his fauly but a spine of Tomkins, Widdop, Smith, Clark and eventually Lockers could easily be an international spine if it was playing to some decent attacking structures.

Poor ball retention lead to england playing most of the game at the wrong end of the pitch.

I though Sean Long must have got his 1st Samoan 'cap' today. Surprised he didn't get MOM.
He was on the pitch longer than some of the players.

Smith did put Samoa under pressure with his kicks. Tomkins could be better utilised at half back with Widdop. Joel Tomkins did enough (just) to earn another chance but Westerman definitely was a weak link defensively (along with Shenton) and on this display he will sit out the remaining matches.

Surprised no one has said to drop Charnley. He was anonymous today and did sod all.

As for people criticising Shenton, two of our tries came off of him. He was the only one backing up Clark. Defensively, he was no worse than others you are all not mentioning.

Hall - 3 missed tackles, Watkins 4 missed tackles, Charnley 3 missed tackles.

Why not drop the entire backline? I'm sure there's an anti-Cas agenda on the VT and it's not surprising as per usual. Take your tinted specs off and see what he did do for England. He's been the best centre in the comp this season and deserves to be playing. You didn't want Clark and Shenton in before the comp started and now you want them removing during. Is it because it's little Cas?

Hardaker in for Tomkins, Burgess in for Charnley, O'Loughlin in for Westerman for me, Ferres in back row and one of Westerman/Whitehead on bench.

A Cas fan with a persecution complex. Well I never.

Not sure what people think McNamara is supposed to do, given the player pool he has available to him. If you want him to have more and better players to pick from, lobby your own club about the number of journeyman overseas players blocking English juniors getting into the first team.

The team he's picked is pretty much the best one available to him. The lack of a gamebreaker in the halves means a fairly conservative gameplan of smashng it up through the forwards and trying to establish some momentum through quick play the balls.

O'Loughlin in for Westerman next week, only change I would make. The Australian pack is there for the taking, very lightweight and with its more experienced players much more interested in niggling rather than actually playing.,

You sound like you have a complex. I think most neutrals like Cas and respect what they've achieved this season. But I also think Shenton was a little more vulnerable than our other threequarters in defence. You quote stats, but the raw numbers don't show the context; some missed tackles can arise when a player chases a lost cause in broken play, for example. Shenton got stood up by his opposite number on one occasion and missed a bad one on the winger towards the end - both led to dangerous situations. Shenton has had a great season, but I have my doubts about him at this level (my club won the title and have no representatives in the international side at all - sometimes it just works like that). He's always struck me as a good lad, though, and I'll be happy if he proves me wrong.

I thought Joel Tomkins was pretty dire tbh, some of his attempted tackles were woeful. Whitehead for Joel, Joe Burgess for Charnley?

I just feel like - after many of years of visiting these forums - that there's always been more of apathetic view towards Cas (or anything Cas).

Irrespective of that, I agree on one occasion Leulia (sp?) did well. But Shenton recovered and brought him down. As I've pointed out, defensively he's not missed any more than any of the other three quarters. A missed tackle is a missed tackle. I'm not sure if an attempt at making a tackle chasing someone really counts as a missed tackle (I'd be surprised if that's counted). My version of a missed tackle is when players come into contact with each other and the attacking player gets free/bounces off/escapes his grasp.

Anyway, when half the side was poor I don't think it's fair to solely pick on Shenny.

Shenton did fine for me. He nearly lost his opposite number a couple of times but recovered and also made a couple of cracking ball n all tackles on him. I always quite fancied seeing Hardaker have a crack there but I'd give Shenton another go next week.

As for Charnley his stats show that we didn't have a fair share of possession (about 110 metres from only 12 carries) because he's usually busier but he made some tough carries and didn't do a lot wrong. He did take one cracking bomb under pressure late on which was a big play. He like Shenton deserves another crack next week. Joe Burgess is a real talent but he'd have done no more today with that amount of possession.