If you deduct tax and NIC from an employee, on behalf of HMRC, and then do not pay that tax over, you have spent money that was never yours and you effectively held on trust for the period allowed before you have to pay it. In any other situation, you would call that theft, would you not?

If you collect VAT on your sales, on behalf of HMRC, and then do not pay that VAT over, then same again is it not?

I have yet to see anyone put up a convincing argument as to why using someone else's money to pay your own bills, and then not being able to pay that money back, is anything other than theft.

Not a dig at London alone, btw - applies to every business that fails owing PAYE and/or VAT.

I'll agree with you totally on your second point, mind!

On the first point...it's more a Moral issue than one of legality..........but I see where you're coming from

I thinks its good to see the money coming back in, its the right time to buy property.

Its a bug arena and when time is rights and grants areabout they make it a place for RL home.

Classic typo my man

Not the point is it you stupid person.

To me it looks like a loan secured against Odsal end of. Absolutely no intention of the RFL ever owning or redeveloping the Stadium. So all the dreamers and SL fantasists back in your box. The Bulls are now on life support and will have to work very hard to ever get back to recent glories and TBH I doubt they will.

As a Wakey fan may I point out to other Wakey fans that we have indeed received loans from the RFL in the past. Last time we asked I couldn't blame the RFL for saying no and as it happened it worked out well.

Adeybull, while it would seem you are correct, it is a cash bail out to save your club, that isnt how the RFL have termed it , no surprise there then, but you havent mentioned the implications with regards the future licensing situation, you do have effectively now a guaranteed SL licence

And ultimatly that is wrong

As I said SL just keeps getting better and better

They have not bought it have they. If you believe the nonesense you've just typed I despair about the naivety and hypocrisy of RL fans.

Fair call mate. I'd not disagree with that.

I think you talk nonsense most of the time Starbug, but I do admire how you can make every single RL story into a negative conspiricy.

Eventually this will turn from 'RFL buy Odsal' to 'It's not fair on Leigh'

On that specific point of future licensing, if the result was to guarantee the club a licence then that would inded be unfair. Albeit hardly more unfair than the way "development" clubs got a guaranteed licence?

But the stadium is only a limited part of the licensing criteria. This action does not directly change the club's ranking against the other criteria, against which (other than on-field performance) the club already rates pretty highly. Nor of course should it directly affect on-field performance. All it does is seemingly guarantee we will still have an old, acceptable-but-ideally-needs-to-be-better stadium to play in rather than say sharing the more modern VP. How does that guarantee us a SL place? We could be binned and the RFL could appoint another franchisee to play at Odsal, and pay the RFL a commercial rent.

Can we please not turn this into another blame-London thread? There are probably enough dobbers reading this to start confusing the issues and their conspiracy theories will become even more fantastic. This is about Bradford.

I have no problem with the bail-out, and I'd love to believe that one day the RFL will have/obtain enough cash to develop a national RL stadium. But I think this has been handled in an awfully cack-handed way. The fact is that there's ammunition here for those who want to see conspiracies, and particularly distrust the RFL. This is a bail-out for Bradford. It needs to be openly acknowledged as such, and the consequences of that decision faced openly. Saying that it's some sort of investment in a historic ground, or saving Bradford from a bizarre private-sector compulsory purchase is nonsense, and it's transparent nonsense. By misleading over motives, the RFL are pouring petrol on to the paranoid fires of a certain type of League-Express letter-writer. They should be open, and state that this has been done to save Bradford from collapse, and while it's a loss now, they hope that this will be a turning point allowing Bradford to reshape their finances and develop a more stable existence, with the possibility of returns either through rent or development in the longer-term.

Two final points :

1) I hope to God the RFL lined up all the other club managements behind this before they did it. I'm sort of assuming they did it this way because there was a by-law or regulation which prvented them from just bunging one member club lots of cash, rather than because they were trying to hide what it was from the other clubs.

2) I've read so many comments on this board, and in the RL press, from people who style themselves RL fans, endlessly banging on about how the RFL is wrong to spend any cash at all south of Doncaster, and how it's ridiculous that we should even allow people who say "barth" rather than "bath" to watch or play our game. They nearly always state that while they're not opposed to spreading the game (of course, how could we ever think such a thing?), the RFL should look after the interests of the "heartland" clubs first. Well here you go people. This is the RFL offering the biggest direct help package to a club that it has ever offered, and it's as heartland as it comes. So I shall look forward to all those "fans" writing here and in the RL press about how pleased they are that the RFL has stepped in to save such a historic and traditional club.

Similarily to Mr Haggerty and despite what many think of me and my opinions on here , if this is a loan from the RFL to protect the demise of Bradford [ possibly due to the image rights issue then fine , the RFL have covered themselves by taking the lease as callateral to ensure it shouldn't end up being a total loss

But once again it is the pathetic attempt to cover it up , using the ' Historic Odsal ' disguise

Odsal isn't historic , the name is , the stadium isn't , we no longer have the historic Wmbley , it is just the name ,

So why try to hide the truth , it took all of a few hours for it to surface

So Bradford were in the brown smelly stuff , the sports governing body has helped them out , there are implications to it , both for other clubs and the licencing process

Does it affect my club ? , no , am I allowed an opinion on it ? , yes , was it ultimatley the right thing to do ? , yes

But stop trying to hide everything , we are plainly not as stupid as you think we are , and assuming that just makes you look more stupid than you actually are