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j.c
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Quote: wrencat1873 "The question of the Bulls participation in SL should have nothing to do with their size or perceived imprtance to the competition.
If their wrongdoing merits a relegation to a lower division then they should be relagated whether it is Bradford, Huddersfield Cas or Salford.
This is what is wrong with SL.
There shouldn't be a group of clubs who are above the game itself and the game should be brave enough to have some principals, rather than trying to contrive
some kind of elite competition.
Let the clubs play for success and ok, if there needs to be some rules to guide us then at least be brave enough to stick to them.'"


Very very good post and may i just add never ever apologise to that prick!

j.c
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Quote: wrencat1873 "Sorry Smokey

IMO its more akin to allowing someone who has broken the rules to compete just because thye hold a record or something, maybe like allowing someone who oversteps the mark in long jump to register a score or who someone who falsestrats to still compete. It may make for a better race, but its not right.

What you appear to be advocating, is that the big clubs should be allowed to do as they please, because they are bigger than the game itself.
Anarchy
Yep thats exactly what he wants...rl to be more elitest than union has ever ever been!

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Quote: SmokeyTA "I dont get this idea that HMRC really give a flying whatsit what league Bradford play in next year. I could understand it if this was some pre-pack with the same old faces involved, but on the basis of brand new owners with no links to the previous regime, why would HMRC care? That symbolic bloodletting would make no difference whatsoever to them.

They arent being 'conned' or having 'their patience tried' by a brand new company with no links to the previous regime, playing as Bradford Bulls in SL rather than the lower leagues.'"


What matters to HMRC is getting their money (some of it at least), now - and, importantly, in the future. 6 points in a relegation-free SL looks a decent exit strategy, if your legacy is turning rotten.

I very much hope a buyer comes forward with a realistic offer and the creditors are realistic in turn - HMRC will get nothing if they go the newco route. Oldco with new owners, creditors 'satisfied' and the Bulls in SL would clearly be cleanest and best for the sport.

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Quote: TheTiger123 "Why do people want Cas to go down so much????? We bring everything to the game (minus this season) apart from a shiny new stadium. We have a great youth system bringing up players such as Danny Orr, Craig Huby, Michael Shenton, Joe Westerman, Daryl Clark etc. We have probably the biggest crowd per population in a town or city in the league, we contest on the field (again, minus this season). We have never entered administration which a lot of teams cannot seem to avoid. I don't get why you are all so against us? nobody has had a go at Cas.

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Quote: Mild Rover "What matters to HMRC is getting their money (some of it at least), now - and, importantly, in the future. 6 points in a relegation-free SL looks a decent exit strategy, if your legacy is turning rotten.

I very much hope a buyer comes forward with a realistic offer and the creditors are realistic in turn - HMRC will get nothing if they go the newco route. Oldco with new owners, creditors 'satisfied' and the Bulls in SL would clearly be cleanest and best for the sport.'"

I'd agree, what matters to HMRC is getting their money. The Newco/oldco this with HMRC is a red herring.
If the Newco starts in championship one, HMRC get nothing
if the Newco starts in SL, HMRC get nothing

it doesnt actually make a blind bit of difference to them, whether a new company, with new owners, using the Bradford Bulls name play in SL or Championship one. The company which owed them money no longer exists and the people who ran up the debts are completely different and not involved, HMRC can no more hold the new owners responsible for the debt than they can Leeds Rhinos, and Hull KR.

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Quote: SmokeyTA "I'd agree, what matters to HMRC is getting their money. The Newco/oldco this with HMRC is a red herring.
If the Newco starts in championship one, HMRC get nothing
if the Newco starts in SL, HMRC get nothing

it doesnt actually make a blind bit of difference to them, whether a new company, with new owners, using the Bradford Bulls name play in SL or Championship one. The company which owed them money no longer exists and the people who ran up the debts are completely different and not involved, HMRC can no more hold the new owners responsible for the debt than they can Leeds Rhinos, and Hull KR.'"


They can't chase a new company for an old company's debts. However they can put pressure on a governing body to try and ensure that its members are not abusing the tax system.
Indeed, there has been a clampdown on exactly this type of "behaviour".

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Quote: wrencat1873 "They can't chase a new company for an old company's debts. However they can put pressure on a governing body to try and ensure that its members are not abusing the tax system.
Indeed, there has been a clampdown on exactly this type of "behaviour".'"

Those people are no longer under the governing bodies remit, the governing body has no power over them any more. Relegating Bradford will, in no way, affect the people who abused the system.

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Quote: SmokeyTA "Those people are no longer under the governing bodies remit, the governing body has no power over them any more. Relegating Bradford will, in no way, affect the people who abused the system.'"


I understand that Smokey, a new limited company acn not be responsible for a previous limited company's debts.
However, the question remains, are the Bulls so important to SL that we can not do without them and before anarchy breaks out rmeember, if they were to liquidate (not going to happen now), we would have to do without them.
The graveyard is full of indispensable people. No person, player, coach or team are more important than the game.

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Hull FC, Huddersfield, London. Not like we haven't been through this before!

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Quote: wrencat1873 "I understand that Smokey, a new limited company acn not be responsible for a previous limited company's debts.
However, the question remains, are the Bulls so important to SL that we can not do without them and before anarchy breaks out rmeember, if they were to liquidate (not going to happen now), we would have to do without them.
The graveyard is full of indispensable people. No person, player, coach or team are more important than the game.'"

They aren’t so important that we cant do without them, they are so important that we need to ask why the hell we are doing without them. Losing Bradford will be a blow, probably not a fatal one but a blow all the same, there will be no benefit to relegating them, so why would we do it In a pique of self-flagellation to appease some hypocrites bemoaning the lack of Corinthian spirit?

SL would be better placed with a functioning Bradford than a functioning Halifax. I know it sounds harsh but the facts and figures show it. We lose Bradford, whichever heartland team we replace them with, we probably lose 5k fans straight off the bat.

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Quote: SmokeyTA "They aren’t so important that we cant do without them, they are so important that we need to ask why the hell we are doing without them. Losing Bradford will be a blow, probably not a fatal one but a blow all the same, there will be no benefit to relegating them, so why would we do it In a pique of self-flagellation to appease some hypocrites bemoaning the lack of Corinthian spirit?

SL would be better placed with a functioning Bradford than a functioning Halifax. I know it sounds harsh but the facts and figures show it. We lose Bradford, whichever heartland team we replace them with, we probably lose 5k fans straight off the bat.'"


So what we need in SL are the top 10,12 or 14 teams with the greatest level of support, regardless of their business acumen and any rules which may be in place within the comp.
Do away with any promotion between the leagues, as the teams in the lower leagues cannot possibly be stronger or more financially viable and pull up the drawbridge.
Stagnation and prosperity in one fell swoop
We should be brave enough to apply the rules and IF the Bulls drop down a league, the CC attendances will probably improve and the new SL club will have its opportunity to prosper icon_biggrin.gif

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Quote: wrencat1873 "So what we need in SL are the top 10,12 or 14 teams with the greatest level of support, regardless of their business acumen and any rules which may be in place within the comp.
Do away with any promotion between the leagues, as the teams in the lower leagues cannot possibly be stronger or more financially viable and pull up the drawbridge.
Stagnation and prosperity in one fell swoop
We should be brave enough to apply the rules and IF the Bulls drop down a league, the CC attendances will probably improve and the new SL club will have its opportunity to prosper 6.8310546875:10
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