FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > bradford bulls problems |
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| Quote: Kosh "The RFL board issue licences based on rules decided by the clubs. They can also only expel a club if the rules - again voted on by the clubs - allow it. The clubs actually have the final say on admission to SL as they own the league pure and simple. There have already been discussions between them on the possible admission of a Bradford newco. Opinions are divided.'"
The RFL were give those "rights" (under the then created set of rules) when the franching system was first set-up :-
"A licence will INITIALLY be for three years however, the independent RFL Board will have the right to revoke a club’s membership if need be at any stage.
Although the reasons for this are still to be finalised it is likely to include insolvency, contractual breach, persistent under performance and possibly persistent rule breaking.
Any ‘failing’ club who has its membership removed could be replaced by a ‘successful’ club from outside engage Super League."
(Taken directly from the RFL on the formation of the licencing system.)
Clubs need to give their agreement to changes to the SuperLeague structure (eg:- adding more team, reducing numbers etc). If the RFL board pull Bulls licence, the RFL board can replace them. I agree that they would seek to do it with the agreement of the clubs, but the rules allow them to do it unilaterally.
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| I think you are both right.
The admission of a newco would be dependent on a vote by the SL club chairmen, the RFL have been given the right of veto.
I fully expect the clubs to vote against the re-admission for Bradford to make their displeasure clear, but full in the knowledge, and as willing participants, the RFL to wield that veto and continue the sterling job they do as a lightening rod for the conspiracy theorists, assorted yokels, and peddlers of nonsense.
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| What we'll find out by this process is if all clubs are treated equally, if Bradford come out of admin like Wakefield did and rebuild in that way, 4 point deduction seems fair
If they go into liquidation, I don't know what other option but relegation. If this was Widnes (my team), Castleford, Salford, Wakefield, London there'd be no debate and people would expect it, and there'd be no arguments. Just because Bradford were one of the "big four" does not give them the right to circumvent the consequences of bad management that led to liquidation
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| Quote: mikej "If the RFL board pull Bulls licence, the RFL board can replace them. I agree that they would seek to do it with the agreement of the clubs, but the rules allow them to do it unilaterally.'"
But that's not what we're talking about, is it? We're talking about what happens if the current Bulls club is liquidated and a newco applies to join in their place. In that situation the power to say yes or no lies ONLY with the club chairmen - just as when the newco London club was admitted.
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| Quote: The Lizard "What we'll find out by this process is if all clubs are treated equally, if Bradford come out of admin like Wakefield did and rebuild in that way, 4 point deduction seems fair
If they go into liquidation, I don't know what other option but relegation. If this was Widnes (my team), Castleford, Salford, Wakefield, London there'd be no debate and people would expect it, and there'd be no arguments. Just because Bradford were one of the "big four" does not give them the right to circumvent the consequences of bad management that led to liquidation'"
If they go into liquidation, there's no club left to relegate and all bets are off.
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| Quote: SmokeyTA "I think you are both right.
The admission of a newco would be dependent on a vote by the SL club chairmen, the RFL have been given the right of veto.
I fully expect the clubs to vote against the re-admission for Bradford to make their displeasure clear, but full in the knowledge, and as willing participants, the RFL to wield that veto and continue the sterling job they do as a lightening rod for the conspiracy theorists, assorted yokels, and peddlers of nonsense.'"
The RFL don't have a veto. They do have a vote. If 8 clubs vote against a newco then they aren't coming in. If the vote is tied I believe that the RFL can then make an additional deciding vote one way or the other.
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Quote: Kosh "The RFL don't have a veto. They do have a vote. If 8 clubs vote against a newco then they aren't coming in. If the vote is tied I believe that the RFL can then make an additional deciding vote one way or the other.'"
I think the RFL not only have the deciding vote, but also Les Catalans vote in these matters,
Though i will try and find a more respectable source
[iFive clubs are prepared to vote against them entering the competition as a new company.
Two more are needed to reject the proposal — although the RFL have the power of veto and can admit the club.[/i
www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... -axed.html
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Quote: Kosh "The RFL don't have a veto. They do have a vote. If 8 clubs vote against a newco then they aren't coming in. If the vote is tied I believe that the RFL can then make an additional deciding vote one way or the other.'"
I think the RFL not only have the deciding vote, but also Les Catalans vote in these matters,
Though i will try and find a more respectable source
[iFive clubs are prepared to vote against them entering the competition as a new company.
Two more are needed to reject the proposal — although the RFL have the power of veto and can admit the club.[/i
www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sp ... -axed.html
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| Quote: SmokeyTA "I think the RFL not only have the deciding vote, but also Les Catalans vote in these matters,
Though i will try and find a more respectable source
[iFive clubs are prepared to vote against them entering the competition as a new company.
Two more are needed to reject the proposal — although the RFL have the power of veto and can admit the club.[/i
Of course Catalan can vote - they're a member of SL.
The RFL do not have a power of veto. Think about it logically - if they alone had the power of veto what would be the point in having a vote at all? The sun are confusing a veto with a deciding vote. And that's also why 8 'no' votes are required and not the 7 quoted.
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| Quote: SmokeyTA "I think the RFL not only have the deciding vote, but also Les Catalans vote in these matters,
Though i will try and find a more respectable source
[iFive clubs are prepared to vote against them entering the competition as a new company.
Two more are needed to reject the proposal — although the RFL have the power of veto and can admit the club.[/i
This isn't true. Nigel Wood was asked this in the last couple of days - the clubs do not have the power to vote on if the Bulls return to Super League. They do however have the power to vote on how many teams are in the franchise.
Any decision on if we remain in Super League will be made by the RFL board.
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| Quote: Paul124897 "This isn't true. Nigel Wood was asked this in the last couple of days - the clubs do not have the power to vote on if the Bulls return to Super League. They do however have the power to vote on how many teams are in the franchise.
Any decision on if we remain in Super League will be made by the RFL board.'"
Semantics. If the Bulls get liquidated then SL becomes a 13 team league, so any newco will need the vote of the club chairmen to be admitted.
If the Bulls survive administration then the clubs don't get a vote at all.
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| Quote: Kosh "Semantics. If the Bulls get liquidated then SL becomes a 13 team league, so any newco will need the vote of the club chairmen to be admitted.
'"
Semantics......NO IT DOESN'T. SuperLeague will still be a 14 team league but with one space on the rosta. As there is no change to the structure/rules it will be the RFL that decides. The RFL will of course talk to the clubs as it will be far easier for them to make a decision knowing what support they have from the other clubs.
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| Dont have strong feelings either way. Bulls voted to kick us out (broncos) and their crowds are falsely inflated by v cheap tickets so not as big a club as some think. But Bradford is the 8th biggest city in England and that gives them huge potential compared to the likes of Fev or Leigh.
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| Does anyone really have any idea how it actually works?
I know i'm confused, theres conflicting information from all angles.
-[iOH it's the RFL they have carte blanche over any rulings should they see fit
-It's the super league clubs, they vote and ultimatly decide
-No it's both, the clubs and rfl all vote
-If the clubs vote and the rfl don't like it they can veto it
-The only time the clubs can vote is if they liquidate and eventually need to be voted back in[/i
Theres just so much uncertainty and confusion about the whole debacle. God only knows what the players and staff must be thinking, this is how they earn their living and it's all up in the air.
What happens with the fixtures if bulls liquidate? What is the process for voting them out/in? is that even a possibility if they don't liquidate?
We need some answers from the RFL. No one knows what the hells going on. They've just sat there and watched this whole mess unfold.
They need to come out and say look, this is the procedure for this eventuality, this is what happens should that come to pass. At least then everyone knows where they stand.
It seems like they are just going to make it up as they go along 'cross that bridge when we come to it' (which wouldn't suprise me at all.
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| Quote: mikej "Semantics......NO IT DOESN'T. SuperLeague will still be a 14 team league but with one space on the rosta. As there is no change to the structure/rules it will be the RFL that decides. The RFL will of course talk to the clubs as it will be far easier for them to make a decision knowing what support they have from the other clubs.'"
Your interpretation differs from that of the club chairmen. I'm betting they have a better grip on things than you do.
The club chairmen will decide on the admission of a Bulls newco to SL. Just as they did with London.
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| Chairmen, the RFL, the fans, the players, nigel wood....its being banded about that everyones going to get to sick their 6 penneth in to the Bulls Newco debate... I think we're all losing sight of who really pulls the purse strings when it comes to SL.....BSKYB or whatever they call themselves these days.
Someone mentioned that Bradford is the 8th biggest city in the UK - assuming thats correct, theres a huge potential for selling sky subscriptions and renewalls and I dare say that not having Bradford Bulls along side Bradford City would see a dip in sales for sky.....
....Just throwing that one out there....
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