FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > Lots of debate let's test the view |
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| Bizarre that they can vote on something with the funding to be sorted out later. Licensing was never done properly, I think we have to get rid of the historical baggage that the game has and have proper licensing as in Aus and merge teams like Wakey and Cas.
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| Quote: bewareshadows "On redvee there is a poster who has posted about why they are coming round to this idea and it's a very well written argument.
I have to say the last few seasons have been pretty dull in terms of the main set of league fixtures.
Did anyone not expect Wigan/Leeds/Saints/Warrington/Catalan/Huddersfield/Hull not to make the top 8.
It's been a cake walk for these teams for years. Now 7 into 4 does not go. So you would imagine the intensity will pick up now that top 8 is not the aim and you can't spend weeks just going through the motions as a win or a loss makes little difference.
Again at the bottom, you could probably predict the bottom 2 clubs in the last few years.
Now the aims of the clubs are to get higher and not just coast as coasting will lead to decline.
I very much doubt this drop off in fans. But lets see the profit and loss accounts come 3 years time.'"
I agree the top part MAY become more exciting. But the problem I can see is similar licensing, meanings games. If was the Bradford coach and realised we won't going to make the 8 cut with 4-5 games to go.
I'd send the senior players to have their operations and clear outs, couple weeks off, come back for the "exciting
" second tier fresh to beat our part time colleagues to make sure they were back in SL the following year.
To do what you mentioned above, we could have done exactly the same with a 12 team comp and a 4/6 team play-off with relegation. Then every team has something to play for until the end of the season and all teams are on level playing field.
This is just the worst of both worlds for me. Yes top
Part may become exciting in the split, but he long term finacial state for clubs yo-yoing between the split could hurt.
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| But better the last 4 games than the last 15
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| I'd be alot happier if they change the top 8 league's 1st round playoff format into 1 v 8 2 v 7 3 v 6 4 v 5 otherwise even before the top 8 split of you have the potential to have 4 teams with nothing whatsoever to play for other then finishing between position 5 & 8 in the table.
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| Quote: Easty "I'd be alot happier if they change the top 8 league's 1st round playoff format into 1 v 8 2 v 7 3 v 6 4 v 5 otherwise even before the top 8 split of you have the potential to have 4 teams with nothing whatsoever to play for other then finishing between position 5 & 8 in the table.'"
If everyone has a shot at the (actual) playoffs where's the point of playing 7 more games after the split? Top 8 playoffs don't work.
Basically everyone wants a system that suits there team best - outside of super league? We want a promotion to play for. Bottom of superleague? - we want something to play for after the 8 is decided. Now it's placed between 5 - 8 and you think there's nothing to play for??? No wonder the rfl picked the most ridiculous idea it can't win!
Also I can't remember when there was a 14 point gap between 4th and 5th
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| MS the playoff is the top 4 AFTER the 7 games
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| Quote: DemonUK "MS the playoff is the top 4 AFTER the 7 games'"
Exactly, my response was to the person who suggested after the 7 games to still have a top 8 playoff ...
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| Quote: Bull Mania "I agree the top part MAY become more exciting. But the problem I can see is similar licensing, meanings games. If was the Bradford coach and realised we won't going to make the 8 cut with 4-5 games to go.
I'd send the senior players to have their operations and clear outs, couple weeks off, come back for the "exciting
" second tier fresh to beat our part time colleagues to make sure they were back in SL the following year.
To do what you mentioned above, we could have done exactly the same with a 12 team comp and a 4/6 team play-off with relegation. Then every team has something to play for until the end of the season and all teams are on level playing field.
This is just the worst of both worlds for me. Yes top
Part may become exciting in the split, but he long term finacial state for clubs yo-yoing between the split could hurt.'"
I did write something about this somewhere.
But basically this would not happen as there is no history of the team in 9th being so far behind they can't make the 8 with 4-5 games to go. When the league was 12. Sometimes there were only 3 points covering 8 -11.
Even in the years of 14 teams it would be only at the last game when people would know they can't make the top 8.
This is my point about some of the negative responses to the SL clubs decision. Scenarios are being thought up that actually have no basis in what has gone before. So yes you could ease off in some years for the last game. But most years you would still be in the running for the 8. The point of cutting the league to 12 is to make those teams closer. They still get a full season of matches against SL opposition, the only difference is that teams outside of the top 8 will now have an extension to their season.
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| Quote: Magic Superbeetle "Exactly, my response was to the person who suggested after the 7 games to still have a top 8 playoff ...'"
Sorry, missed that
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| Quote: Red Red Robin "There are many reasons why I disagree with it such as ST issues and how the whole thing is to be funded but the main one for me is that even though the 2nd tier is to receive an increase in funding in order to close the gap between themselves and the top tier, it is not going to solve the problem of the bottom 4 teams from the top tier being accustomed to playing at a higher and faster standard than the top 4 from the 2nd tier, and I doubt that 7 games is going to be enough for the 2nd tier teams to get up to speed.'" I bet youd be happy if you were still floundering in the championship days of down and stay down.
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| Bottom line if your teams in bottom 4 its theyre for a reason.So instead of teams malingering at bottom knowing season is dead now they have to fight to stay up and the top4 of the championship have warrented their right to see of the bottom 4 of the super league gives them hope knocks complacency out of bottom 4 of super league whats the prob?
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| If the top 'championship clubs' could afford to go full time, I would have brought back promotion/relegation. 1 up/1 down....but as my club have been stuck in the 'RL Wilderness' for years, this is better than leaving it as it was.
Guess we'll have to wait & see, but splitting into 3 leagues of 8 seems a little odd, and unbalanced. As for league 2, right now, if (part timers) Fev, Halifax, Leigh, Sheffield, Batley etc were to beat a SL side in the challenge cup it would be a shock, never mind winning a few, so that you can get into the top 4 of the 'mini league'.
Time will tell.....
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| Quote: Budgiezilla "As for league 2, right now, if (part timers) Fev, Halifax, Leigh, Sheffield, Batley etc were to beat a SL side in the challenge cup it would be a shock, never mind winning a few, so that you can get into the top 4 of the 'mini league'.
Time will tell.....'"
Those teams in the championship now can only spend £300k on player salaries. The SL clubs will spend along a range of £1.1 million - £1.8 million so even the top KPC clubs are limited to 20% of the budget of a team in the mid range of spending in SL. From 2015 those clubs in the second 12 will be able to spend up to £900k (treble what they have been able to spend up to now). The spending power of the top 12 will remain unchanged so the gap could lessen for the top KPC clubs significantly. In recent years Cas who, no disrespect intended, are likely to be one of the bottom 4 in the top 12 in the early years at least were beaten by Barrow and Featherstone and were very lucky to beat Halifax, Huddersfield, a top half of SL team scraped through against Batley. Though those are rare instances they were involving teams with at best 27% of the budget of their opponent. When that budget is 75% of that of their opponent then the difference is hardly stark. A club coming into the middle 8 from the 2nd 12 beating one of the 4 sides coming from the top 12 is not likely to be so rare an event as those past cup shocks. A "SL2" team may only need a single win over a "SL1" team to gain promotion in any given season particularly given the presence of the 4th v 5th playoff.
As you say time will tell but the raising of budget potential for the second tier largely removes the forced chasm in finances. A club with three times the playing budget may not be wholly part time but have a core of FT players. Nobody knows what will happen but the drastic changing of the (potential) spending power of the top KPC clubs bringing them much closer to the lower end of SL means that even the recent past is not as accurate a yardstick as many seem to think it is.
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| Quote: rafsanjhani "I bet youd be happy if you were still floundering in the championship days of down and stay down.'"
For me a floundering Rovers in the championship is better than no Rovers at all so yes, I'd still be happy.
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| I still think you will get yo-yoing of super league teams with this format as well. Whichever 2 teams drop at the end of the forthcoming season I would assume would be in the top 4 of the championship the season after. So in reality you have 6 SL teams fighting for 4 SL places. I don't think the current championship teams will get a look in.
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