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Quote: wrencat1873 "I get the dream and almost agree with you (in principle) but, it's not going to happen.
The French sides are in RL playing areas, with junior development etc and can play throughout the current season.
However, Toronto are just not in this category.
Effectively, they are taking the place of a UK/French side in the top flight and whilst, no doubt there is interest when they come over and play their games, primarily because of their huge salary spend which makes them a "big draw" but what is the actual plan for RL in UK/Europe.
IF there are to be 3 or 4 N. American sides plus 2 French sides in SL, are we to have just 6 UK clubs competing in the top flight and where are the players going to come from because it sure as hell isn't N. America.
We are in a catch 22, where the game needs more money and with the next Sky deal likely to be a reduction, just what do the RFL think the future of RL looks like.
The utter bull smidt about this fitting with the RFL plan really makes me cringe, especially when nothing is publicised about what the hell their plan is.
IMO this expansion, far from growing the game will probably be the death of it and with only half a dozen FT pro clubs in England, what happens next.
Is the Championship going to be a pop n crisps league ?? feeding the SL clubs the occasional player.
I've watched RL for over 50 years but it's time to do something else Big Nige and his successor have destroyed RL.'"

I can understand your concerns however at the moment with these teams in League 1 and the Championship any negatives they may bring by replacing a British club such as player production are virtually nil. So it’s not a risk at the moment.

Also I can’t agree in the slightest about Nigel Wood and the current RFL destroying RL. The RL clubs did that back in the 80’s and 90’s and we’ve been firefighting ever since.

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Quote: MGarbutt1986 "But the point remains, what are these clubs adding for the week to week fans, I don't know many RL fans that can afford a trip to Toronto, New York, Tolouse and Perpignan in a season.'"
never mind the fans some clubs will struggle to meet the financial demand

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Quote: snowie "never mind the fans some clubs will struggle to meet the financial demand'"


None of that seems to matter in the new "world" league.

With so few clubs turning a profit, especially as you go down the league pyramid, adding a couple of overseas trips each season could well make the difference between life and death.
In an ideal world, this wouldn't be too critical but, with where we are currently, we are far more likely to see more clubs go bust than to benefit from the big spending new boys.
Again, it seems like The RFL are happy to keep rolling the dice, without too much concern.
They appear to believe that RL is a major sport, with a budget to match. Mind you even they (the RFL) are blowing a fortune. d040.gif d040.gif

They missed the opportunity to have Toronto and Toulouse in SL during the restructure, which would have allowed everyone to see if Toronto really was workable but, our visionary leaders allowed that opportunity to pass us by.

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JESUS WEPT :WALL: HOW MANY TIMES????? £20 a ticket and £15 on beer and merchandise.....so an away fan is worth £35. At best, 1,000 is the average away support split across 11 rounds and I am being really generous here, so Toronto, replacing say Wakefield will cost a SL club £35,000. The minimum turnover of a SL club is £4,000,000 so Toronto instead of Widnes is worth less than 1% of a SL clubs turnover. There are many valid reasons for and against expansion into America, but "AWAY FANS" isn't one of them. :BEAT::d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_76030.jpg



Quote: snowie "never mind the fans some clubs will struggle to meet the financial demand'"

Indeed.

The NFL can fill Wembley whenever they want, but the London Monarchs and the WLAF/NFL Europe vanished up their own bottoms with financing that we can never hope to match. The US TV markets lost interest nearly as quickly as they started showing games and that was when the Monarchs were playing in front of 40,000 a game....by the time they folded they were on fewer than 6,000.

What we have here is 2 more North American sides looking to join the European competition, with private financing in place (we assume) and an idea of how they will become self sufficient in a short space of time. The Problem is, that whilst the Monarchs would have benefited from the Channel 4 coverage of the NFL in previous years, these teams in NYC and Canada 2 are literally the same as christian missionaries heading to africa.....they are preaching to an audience with an already busy schedule of things to do in their leisure time and whom have no idea what Rugby League is. Even Toronto have had to get involved with the Union lot to achieve the smallest of footholds.

I am all for expansion, but it isn't going to save the game or secure a mega-bucks TV deal, at least not inside the next 10 years and what the game in Europe Needs now is a documented plan with accountability for it......not Hemel flogging their RFL membership to a group who think a local derby will "ignite interest".....the NFL threw Millions at the Claymores with the same goal......we all know where that ended up

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Relocating a club is just stupid.

I know Hemel may not have masses of fans, but I'm guessing those fans it has that have been loyal for years will be lost to the sport if the relocation happens.

A NY team is interesting but like Toronto, they will only ever be a novelty like Catalans.

Catalans are a good side, but in all the years they have been in SL, has it really helped investment into the further development of their domestic league? Or has it just been a distraction and not really helped increase the following of the sport in France as a whole? You may point to Toulouse, but they have been on the fringes for as long as Catalans? Have Paris SG seen a big increase in support since the Catalans success?

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Onwards and upwards - LTID:



Be interesting to see where the players come from for 2 further transatlantic teams.
Toronto seem to have taken the cream of the “not quite good enoughs”, so the pot seems a little low for another 50 or so

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Quote: ColD "Be interesting to see where the players come from for 2 further transatlantic teams.
Toronto seem to have taken the cream of the “not quite good enoughs”, so the pot seems a little low for another 50 or so'"

Indeed, and this is my concern, Toronto largely hoovered up the former SL players and still didn't get promoted.

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Quote: Gallanteer "Relocating a club is just stupid.

I know Hemel may not have masses of fans, but I'm guessing those fans it has that have been loyal for years will be lost to the sport if the relocation happens.

A NY team is interesting but like Toronto, they will only ever be a novelty like Catalans.

Catalans are a good side, but in all the years they have been in SL, has it really helped investment into the further development of their domestic league? Or has it just been a distraction and not really helped increase the following of the sport in France as a whole? You may point to Toulouse, but they have been on the fringes for as long as Catalans? Have Paris SG seen a big increase in support since the Catalans success?'"


Considering super league and rugby league in the UK in general is on life support, what have all SL clubs done to help investment into the further development of their domestic league or has it just been a distraction and not really helped increase the following of the sport in the uk as a whole?

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Quote: Ruune Rebellion "Considering super league and rugby league in the UK in general is on life support, what have all SL clubs done to help investment into the further development of their domestic league or has it just been a distraction and not really helped increase the following of the sport in the uk as a whole?'"

It isn't SL's purpose to increase support or participation, that is down to the blazers at Red Hall, but all they want to do is keep a certain club happy.

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Quote: MGarbutt1986 "It isn't SL's purpose to increase support or participation, that is down to the blazers at Red Hall, but all they want to do is keep a certain club happy.'"


Correct, just like its not Catalans purpose but that doesnt stop people claiming Catalans have done nothing

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Quote: Ruune Rebellion "Correct, just like its not Catalans purpose but that doesnt stop people claiming Catalans have done nothing'"

Not me, Catalans have given a lot of retiring Aussies a boost to their pension pot, and away fans an excuse for a long weekend away. And the Castille bar has made a handsome amount of money.

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Quote: Ruune Rebellion "Considering super league and rugby league in the UK in general is on life support, what have all SL clubs done to help investment into the further development of their domestic league or has it just been a distraction and not really helped increase the following of the sport in the uk as a whole?'"


Well, for a kick off, they've made it possible for plastic teams like Toronto (and New York) to have a league to join.
The irony of your comment is wonderful. d040.gif d040.gif d040.gif d040.gif

Do us a favour and give us your vision of SL in 20 years time, assuming that it still actually exists ??
Also, give a timescale on when there will be ANY N. American SL quality players actually playing the game.

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Quote: Ruune Rebellion "Correct, just like its not Catalans purpose but that doesnt stop people claiming Catalans have done nothing'"


Catalans as a club are doing OK and are competitive. They themselves are not responsible for getting more RL into France. However, the whole point of admitting them in the first place is that it would be good to help RL in France as a whole, which it clearly hasn't been (for whatever reason - lack of further investment?).

These new clubs might all be fine, but lets not pretend that they will help the game expand when they might all just turn out to be novelties like Catalans. In the end, they actually distract from the need to develop their domestic leagues properly and really expand.

And yes, more could be done in the UK as well, but if the RFL continues to work on overseas clubs, they are distracted again in the other direction.

New York RL would be fun to see, but lets not kid ourselves into thinking it is anything more than a novelty.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "Well, for a kick off, they've made it possible for plastic teams like Toronto (and New York) to have a league to join.
The irony of your comment is wonderful. 4.892578125:5
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