Really? And how do you propose to change the mindset of not only current loyal club fans but also the general non-RL supporting bystander?

Speak to a lot of RU fans they find RL slow and boring! Ironic I would say but then we have to accept this is how they see our game.

The international calander in Cricket, Union and other sports is much more packed than it is in League, we don't have a world wide interest in league that could enable the calander to be busier.

In any business or sport you have to stick to your strengths and for Rugby League that is a strong club based sport with plenty of inovative ideas and quirks to keep the fringe supporters happy.

Accept international RL is never going to be as big as other sports, dream as much as you like but many have tried and many more will fail.

Prior to 1995 rugby league had experienced bad times and good times. However they was a time when rugby league was more popular in Leeds than football. Even if we put all the money into the clubs that stood above Leeds United in some part of last century, it wouldn’t make rugby league rule again here. But it’d certainly bring the attendance numbers up.

Now you raise the point of sky TV. I think that Sky/Super League has no doubt saved the game in England. However here in 2011 we’re at a different era all together. Whilst I appreciate Harlequins – I think that Crusaders were a step too far. I just think that if we had a stronger professional heartland – it’d benefit the sport a lot more than the outposts we currently have in the shape of Crusaders and Harlequins. I’m not just talking about the Yorkshire and Lancashire heartlands either.

I’m sure that a stronger French heartlands would improve the super league tenfold too.

That's fair enough Nick but we'll watch some more top players move to union.

And we will also watch some top players stay in the game. I hope we do not see a mass exodus to Union because as much as it hurt against Warrington watching Myler breeze past our defenders with such ease was quite a sight, just like watching Tomkins becoming the player we all love to hate but would love our own little Sam!!

I think with the NRL and Union trying to poach all of our better youngsters we have to feel proud of how well our youth structures are even though they are heavily criticised by many in our sport. We do not have a strong youth league for our players to develop in and a lot of the time they are thrust into first team action too young but how good could our players be if we were able to iron out those issues? Now that is worth dreaming about!

Also look at the positives, players like Burrow, McGuire, Sinfield must have had offers or at least scouts looking at them from the Tykes. Those players stayed loyal to the sport and there is no reason why a large percentage of others will not. Eastmond is making the right choice for himself, the money is hard to turn down but at the end of the day has he gone too early? Hardly made a dent on the England set-up when he promised so much and now his below par performances are making him more of an enemy of the sport.

id take a strong club game over a strong int. game anyday

i wouldnt swap what RL has got for what RU has got on a world wide basis

It would be great if our international game could become more popular but I have no idea how to be honest. When England play Australia in the heartlands we still struggle to sell out the stadium.

I just think we have to accept that our game is more about the clubs. We have a strong club based game in Europe and Australia/NZ and this is a good thing.

You are wrong and obviously have no understanding of the games history then. You are using ignorance to justify the status quo and small mindedness.

When did the RL start the World cup and when did RU.

there are two problems for RL in regard to the international game

complete mismanagement of the international game by the RFL and the ARL. eg constanly changing riules competitions, no longer term workable strategy, ignoring overseas markets for too long.

The ARL has enough money to have a team in PNG ( even now most RL fans in this country would be happy to say goodbye to catalans and oppose Toulouse getting a franchise). a second NZ team would almost wipe out RU in NZ from a competitive point of view


they could quite easily set up semi pro teams in plces like samoa, fiji etc and then filter the best players into a pacific islanders joint team to give a professional career path.

When attempts to set things up they have been half d and planned ie PSG.

In this country trying to run before they can walk has destroyed the international game. having home nations instead of home nations and GB for big competitions undercut any possibility of having meaningful international matches.

People like you are those who will lead this game into terminal decline although i do accept that you are in the majority as the club vs country thread showed.

Most RL supporters are thick, parochial, one eyed numpties unfortunately. So i doubt that anything will change and we will be having these same debates in 20 years time at which point RL will cease to exist except as an amateur game or as feeders to RU teams. The only thing that saves RL at the minutes is RU is too focused on international stuff. But if they were to put their huge financial muscle into expanding RL ( in this country at least) they would wipe RL out. All this guff about the RL being the greatest game is , because at the end of the day Money talks. We cannot comptete without a radical sea change in RL attitudes.

By being competitive. You probably wont watch England vs France because it is too one sided. If England or better GB looked like they could give australia a game they might turn up.

You make some strong points. Good post!

Have you ever been to NZ? RU may ebb and flow there but it'll always, ALWAYS be the number 1 sport.

excellent post

give the nrl time when it gets more money it will be taking over in places like fiji, samoa and tonga

i agree on a PNG NRL team and a 2nd NZ NRL side would puts RU in a lot of pressure

"Most RL Supporters are thick" also translated to "Most RL supporters have a different opinion to mine and they are all wrong".

With a strong club game the RFL and ARL probably thought by then taking the best players and putting them in international jerseys the fans of ALL clubs would come out and support them.

You might travel to watch England (or GB) on a regular basis I don't know but at a guess the general RL supporter is from the North, they have an average salary of somewhere in the region of 20k per year. They probably have families to keep, mortgage or rent to pay, bills...etc you know the things that allow you to survive. Out of whatever they have spare and sometimes what they have to beg for they spend on a season pass for their club. Is this because they are "Thick"? No it is because RL is a hobby for most people, a pastime, something they can release from their daily worries and think about something else for 80 or so minutes. They do not however feel a connection with our national team, the most clubs out of the top 3 get are usually 1 player at the most so they don't even have much to go and watch from the club they love so dearly. Would I pay to go and watch EVERY Hull KR game? Yes I would. Would I go and watch England if they played at the KC stadium? Yes I would. Would I go to Wigan to watch them? No I wouldn't. I can hardly afford to go and watch all the Rovers games but then having to shell out about £20 for a ticket and £40 fuel for an international game that I can watch on TV would be taking it too far.

I am not trying to be small minded or one of the status quo I am trying to be realistic. The ship has sailed from when international RL was a big thing, watching Hanley running through a gap and Offiah going the length used to be something to go and watch because it was rare to see it, now you will see a 95kg stand off go 90mtrs with a two wingers and a centre chasing him down. Int RL used to be about seeing the best of the best, I can do that by watching the SL or NRL on the TV every week.

As for Union's international game doing so well, that is because they have diluted their leagues with so many teams that the average fan in the south wants to see all those best players come together and watch what is usually not a bad specatacle of a game compared to the rubbish they are served up on a weekly basis, just like RL used to be pre-1995.

That is why i used the word COMPETIVELY] if you creamed off the top 20 or 30 NZRU players you would tun them from being in the top 3 in the world to maybe the top 10.

There would be a market because you just need to look at all the top NZRU players who are plying their trade in Europe because money talks

People have been predicting a mass exodus of players to Union ever since Union went pro. I remember Steve Ryder, ahead of a challenge cup final, sneeringly remarking could the game withstand the Union scouts being present in the crowd with the cheque book in hand.

The reality is that so far we have seen nothing of the sorts, with some players making a success of their move and some coming back. No player is bigger than the sport itself and while the players certainly deserve to be on higher wages, the game and/or clubs should not be bankrupting themselves in an effort to keep them. Also, if you give in to players demands for more money or they go to Union, at what point do you say no? and who do you say it to? I've said it all over the place over the past few days, the issue of the salary cap is merely the symptom of the problem, the real problem is that RL does not bring in enough £ - if you fix that problem, then the salary cap level can be fixed as a result of an increased revenue.

Ultimately, if a RL player can earn more money from a RU club, then I say good luck to them and I hope they make a success of it, no job is worth more than your next pay cheque.