FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > British Producing More Skilful Players?? |
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| Quote: BrisbaneRhino "Its no coincidence that almost all the genuine Brits are forwards though. I think a couple of backs could make a go of the NRL, but not a single halfback, supposedly the most 'skilful' position.'"
Bang on !
Britain has some excellent players in most positions but, we certainly struggle to produce top class half-backs.
We are so weak in this area, that lots of folk are clamouring for Sam Tomkins to move back in to the halves for the 4N.
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| I was watching some footage of Tony Myler the other day and was taken back at how skilful he was, i also had a huge opinion of Paul Sculthorpe as a lock forward.
The depressing thing for English RL is the number halfback for SL clubs in 2015, way too many average overseas players and clubs showing very little faith in developing from within. It will be interesting to see who Hull KR are trying to sign to replace Burns & Keating, I would suggest they try and sign Sam Powell or Ryan Hampshire or both from Wigan.
Players like Ryan Brierley deserve an opportunity as well.
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| Quote: BrisbaneRhino "Its no coincidence that almost all the genuine Brits are forwards though. I think a couple of backs could make a go of the NRL, but not a single halfback, supposedly the most 'skilful' position.'"
You've saved me the trouble. All four MOS candidates and the previously-cited examples of Graham and the Burgesses illustrate this perfectly.
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| Quote: The Eclipse "I was watching some footage of Tony Myler the other day and was taken back at how skilful he was, i also had a huge opinion of Paul Sculthorpe as a lock forward.
The depressing thing for English RL is the number halfback for SL clubs in 2015, way too many average overseas players and clubs showing very little faith in developing from within. It will be interesting to see who Hull KR are trying to sign to replace Burns & Keating, I would suggest they try and sign Sam Powell or Ryan Hampshire or both from Wigan.
Players like Ryan Brierley deserve an opportunity as well.'"
With promotion and relegation back on the agenda, clubs in the lower half of SL will revert to "tried and tested" average journeyman pro's, instead of developing their own juniors.
The bigger clubs like Wigan, Saints and Leeds have the luxury of knowing that they will finish in the top 8 and therefore they can carry on drip feeding their youngsters into their respective squads.
Although the franchise/ licensing idea didn't work properly, the junior development was probably the biggest plus and junior development will decline, with the return of promotion and relegation.
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| Quote: The Eclipse "I was watching some footage of Tony Myler the other day and was taken back at how skilful he was, i also had a huge opinion of Paul Sculthorpe as a lock forward.
The depressing thing for English RL is the number halfback for SL clubs in 2015, way too many average overseas players and clubs showing very little faith in developing from within. It will be interesting to see who Hull KR are trying to sign to replace Burns & Keating, I would suggest they try and sign Sam Powell or Ryan Hampshire or both from Wigan.
Players like Ryan Brierley deserve an opportunity as well.'"
Powell is likely to get the #6 shirt for next year. Wane has also stated Hampshire will get game time at #1 and #6 with him likely to get the #1 shirt for 2016 when Bowen retires.
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| Tony Myler played at a time when there was a lot more time and space for attacking players. As did John Holmes, John Woods, Andy Greg etc etc.
Developing halfbacks of real quality is much harder today than it was, and other skills - notably kicking and strong defence - are valued as much if not more than passing ability. As an example, much as I admire their tenacity, Hodkinson and Reynolds are nowhere near the standard of ball handlers you'd expect from the NSW incumbent halfbacks. Pearce and Maloney ditto (although Pearce could still surprise). Even Cooper Cronk is not really fun to watch - does his job fantastically well but such a regimented player.
In fact in a decade I suspect that only Thurston from the current crop of halfbacks will be seen as even approaching greatness (DCE seems to have really stalled this year - he could kick on again though).
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| Quote: Ovavoo "It would appear that way, in that we produce and acclaim individual skills but IMO Rugby League Aussie style is the top of the evolutionary tree.
Size, speed and structure are everything, nothing else matters. It beats any gallant loser with individual brilliance any day.
Maybe there is a role, when two teams are equally matched for an Andy Gregory bit of magic but it will only happen as a one off.
Winning games consistently is the Aussie way and the right way.'"
You might be correct in what you say but! I think the reason league has not grown is that the fans here are not entertained with the arm wrestle? wining the ruck? & the need to speed up the game? or any other trendy catch phrase that gets trotted out. What realy lifts crowds is that bit of magic, off the cuff unscripted gamble. We soon forget the solid defence the safe full back. What we remember is the droped shoulder flatfooting the defender & the weaving run through half the opposing team to score. The reason we dont get that is that the skillfull players dont have tired forwards to run at, 10 interchanges & 4 on the bench have seen to that. The Aussies may win everything but I suspect a lot of british fans would prefer to watch the more open structured game that we used to play before the fully pro era. But you can't put the genie back in the bottle.
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| Quote: Suzy Banyon "This is a load of rubbish. If we're so capable of nurturing talent from a young age where are our top class centres?'"
Even in Australia they struggle to produce real great centres. Centres need to have the physical attributes of a top class second row forward with the handling skills of a half back. Watkins is the nearest we have produced since Keith Senior - pity he is coached by Brian McDermott and not Tony Smith.
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| Quote: BrisbaneRhino "Tony Myler played at a time when there was a lot more time and space for attacking players. As did John Holmes, John Woods, Andy Greg etc etc.
'"
Interesting in that they used to play in the days when defences were only back 5 metres.
The fact is that English players these days don't get the opportunity because of the obsession with signing overseas players.
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| Quote: The Eclipse "Interesting in that they used to play in the days when defences were only back 5 metres.
The fact is that English players these days don't get the opportunity because of the obsession with signing overseas players.'"
The also played in an era where defence was nowhere near as organised as it is now and much slower - if we went back to five yards you would just have five rushes and a kick
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| The difference between player development here and in Australia is that they are committed to it in an holistic way, we are not.
Before being granted a franchise, a club must show they have a seamless production line of players from schools upwards, within a defined geographic area. Their development plans are tested and must be approved prior to entry to the NRL.
We just make sure that a club's not playing on a tatey field and they've got some dosh in the bank or a sugar daddy that will deposit some dosh in the bank.
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| Tbf they also have pokie dens spending millions on jnr clubs, a lot easier to get kids playing when rego and kit are free and facilities and coaching is excellent. One of the big leagues clubs will spend more on jnr rl than majority of SL clubs put together.
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| Quote: Sal Paradise "The also played in an era where defence was nowhere near as organised as it is now and much slower - if we went back to five yards you would just have five rushes and a kick'"
That doesn't make sense.
If there was less space (ie 5 meters instead of 10), why would this lead to more of a "power" game.
I'd gamble that IF we returned to 6 yards (or 5 metres), the short kicking game would return, together with attacking with a
deeper line, although with the fitness levels that we currently have, territory would be at an absolute premium.
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| Quote: JB Down Under "Tbf they also have pokie dens spending millions on jnr clubs, a lot easier to get kids playing when rego and kit are free and facilities and coaching is excellent. One of the big leagues clubs will spend more on jnr rl than majority of SL clubs put together.'"
They don 't spend millions on junior clubs, the clubs have to fund raise like every club in the Uk. Also rego is not free, in fact if you don 't pay your rego you don 't play !!
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| I would like to see all junior games return to 5m.
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