Ryan Bailey has done it zero times, he isnt much of a half-back.

It wasn’t his argument, it was mine, and that wasn’t even what I said.

If it’s the here and now that is important Brough would struggle to get in the Scotland side he was that appalling in the play-offs. The fact he was pretty decent early season is of no consequence to anyone.

And where was Brough on GF night?

I think that was more Smokeys point.

Do you really believe that in the last 12 months Sinfield has been better than Peacock, Charnley, Tomkins, Brough, Barba, C Smith, Thurston, SBW, Inglis and a whole host of other players on both sides of the world?

When he won the award there was uproar. When Brough won MoS a lot of well dones.

Take you Leeds hat off, use your head and not your heart and validate how worthy he was for the award on the basis of his skills as a footballer over the last 12 months.

His point looked at the past as well as GF night. Shall we blame Brough entirely for Huddersfield's perennial act of bottling during the playoffs or is it the team as a whole who bottled it? As for Sinfield, in a side that has history of reaching finals and not bottling it in the playoffs (brilliantly when they won from 5th twice) he is a part of a side rather than the standout element. Doesn't make him a bad player but I can't remember watching a game and thinking, "he is running the opposition ragged, this is the Kevin Sinfield show."

He is part of a hugely successful club side but not the be all and end all of it.

I think the point is you can't use one award to big up one player then discount awards that the other player has won.

Brough won the MOS and I think it was between him and Peacock, how that means he would have guided England to WC victory Ive no Idea when he couldn't even guide his Club side from the top of the table to the GF.

Discounting the fact he's Scottish, if we were picking on form like everyone bangs on about Broughs form in the playoffs was poor.

Well considering he was awarded the golden boot 12 months ago what he has done over the past 12 months is irrelevant.

Fact is 2012 when he won the award he took leeds to two finals, winning one of them and was instrumental in all our big games, including winning the Harry Sunderland award (how many of those does Brough have?), the best player on the best team in one of only 2 pro leagues we have deserves to be in any golden boot discussion.

But i bet you'd credit Brough with Huddersfield success had they achieved any wouldn't you!

Anyway I rate Brough I think he's a great player but same as Widdop he's not Englands saviour, partly because he wasn't committed to actually playing for them.

Kevin Sinfield has a golden boot, 2 harry sunderland awards a mom in a WCC and a lance todd trophy. Im sure he doesn’t care that you don’t think he has ever had a stand out game.

Ah the old argument.

When Huddersfield do well, it's all because of how brilliant Brough is.

When Huddersfield's season turns to sewage when the pressure comes on (as usual) none of it is ever Brough's fault.

The RL watching public (including the Giants pet journalist at The Times) make him out to be some sort of cross between Wally Lewis and Peter Sterling in their prime and are blind to his failings.

Do you honestly think Brough would have finally have picked Scotland if he had been given a chance with England (he missed three years Scotland rep time to ensure he was qualified for England)? Someone else on another thread pointed out that McNamara as good as wrote him off during a boots n all program last season which is the reason he returned to representing Scotland.

By the way, see below for descriptions of both awards. Key words highlighted.

Started in 1977, the Man of Steel Award annually honours the outstanding player in the British game. Originally voted on by members of the Rugby Football League press and, from 2008, by Super League players themselves, the award has often bypassed the top try scorer, winning captain or great International player

The Rugby League World Golden Boot Award is a rugby league award handed out annually for achievements in rugby league by Rugby League World magazine. The Golden Boot is given, usually in December after the conclusion of all the year's matches, to the player adjudged to be the best in the world, as determined by a ballot of former players and international rugby league journalists.

Brough picked Scotland because he hadn't been guaranteed the starting halfback spot, that is not the sign of a team player and has all the hallmarks of a dummy spit.

Im not sure what you are trying to point out with your second paragraphs?

Should all MOS recipients be first choice for the country? your description of the award even discounts that idea, funny you didn't highlight that bit.

Not my description of the award, ones I found. Point is one is picked by hacks and the player's peer group the other is from hacks and ex-players. One has therefore much greater currency.

As for Brough and his dummy spitting to the earlier poster,,, he wasn't selected by McNamara, that is how he ended back with Scotland.

rlhttp://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/mar/05/scotland-rugby-league-team-huddersfieldgiantsrl

Look, years from now I will think about the old days and I will remember Ellery Hanley as a supreme athlete, I will remember Jason Robinson being able to dance around players, I will remember Thomas Leulai being tough as teak and braver than his size should suggest he will be, I will remember Mal Meninga running like a wilderbeest through GB lines and I will remember some great, great players I have had the privilege of watching and I will remember Sinfield and think, a legend as a club captain, Leeds and him were worthy SL champs on multiple occasions. But I know I will also remember he wasn't a scrum half and there were much better options (Smith at Wigan, Myler at Warrington etc) who should have been wearing the shirt in lieu of him when we had our very, very best chance at winning the WC.

In days gone by he has been shoehorned in at 9 and 6 (why has it been an obsession with GB and Eng coaches to play LF at 6?) as he couldn't get a game in the back row as there were much better options. In cricket a great captain can play at international level and bring out the best from those around him (Brearley in 81 Eng v Aus) but in RL there is no place for such a role. A captain not only has to be inspirational they also need to be the best player on the park for their side, or nearly the very best. Sinfield unfortunately isn't.

Yeah, because everyone will certainly give more currency to Gareth Hock and Jordan Tansey’s opinion than Wally Lewis and Peter Sterlings.

If you think either of them went for Sinfield over Cameron Smith, Cooper Cronk or Ben Barba you probably think the world begins and ends on the east side of Leeds.