Look at F Estebanez, more suited to RL, if B Guasch spent big on development of local talent 99% of the best will be bought by RU clubs, and with all the travelling involved, I don't see the point of having Catalonia in SL. Just have British teams. Have a good semi-professional French league, and lets see what new laws RU come up with over the next 2 years. Wayne Pivac said yesterday he's expecting quite significant changes, meaning the sport will go closer to RL. Who knows, maybe a few wealthy French guys will just adopt RL laws, or very similar ones, as they say, never say never.

Yes. I have mentioned this before on this thread I think. Might have been the other one.

Makes me laugh when people accuse Catalans of not producing players when half of SL and vast majority of lower leagues don’t. Some don’t even have academies? Catalans may not be perfect but they are damn sight better than some.

Someone accused Toronto of not producing players. How can you expect to produce Championship/SL standard players in 4 years in a country that’s hardly ever played League and doesn’t have a decent amateur game? Stupid point. I do concede that they should have done more with the camps and players such as Quinn Ngawati, Joe Eichner, Rhys Jacks, Monti Gaddis etc though.

France as a county are going to be nowhere near the levels of England/GB in terms of talent. Our player pool is so much bigger, more hotbeds of RL, better amateur system, RL didn’t get banned over here whereas in France it was illegal for a time. That beds into culture and a whole generation or two will have played something else which filters down to their kids etc. If RL was banned in this country for a length of time we might only ever see an amateur game again if it did come back.

If there was a rule stating that at least 6-7 of the match day 17 had to be home grown. Catalans would probably still get playoffs or at least compete. A number of other clubs wouldn’t. I’ll let you decide which ones.

No.

It's not really......It's a way of pretending Catalans have a development system.

Let's just think about this. Junior French RL is still played around the south of France. 30,000 people are supposedly registered as RL players, so there is a significant game there. After a few years once Les Catalans got established in Superleague they put together an Academy side and Les Catalans academy used to be a good side that could easily hold it's own.

Currently there are no "Reserve teams" so NO St.Esteve are not a reserve team, they are a club in their own right. I don't think if all SL clubs had to have reserve teams that they would get away with such ideas that Milford were actually Leeds "A" or Lock Lane were in fact "Castleford "A"........

If St Esteve were their reserve team then can any of us make a list of St. Esteve juniors that have gravitated to a first team Catalans jersey??? The thing is I can name you (and already have) an almost full strength Les Catalans side that would contain no French players at all.

It's glaringly obvious that Les Catalans have no player development systems at all and their owner simply buys in the best English and antipodeans he can, some like Folau at an enormous cost that could easily have kept Catalans academy going.........

The lower leagues are not relevant to the debate at all. Professional Superleague clubs are supposed to run player development systems.

Catalans do not. They came into the game on the idea that they were the club that would develop French professionals to bring back the test matches, so why do you ignore that fact? They actually did set the systems up at one time and they worked....so they themselves conceded the requirement so why apologise for them now they have dumped it?

The only comparable club without much of a development system is Salford who struggle for money and risk their own inclusion in SL. Folau's wage would cover a return of the Catalans academy. Go figure.

Toulose are set to follow Les catalans, do you think it great that if they did this they would boot the French lads out of their team for Aussies? Perhaps have a chat with John Kear about the importance of junior development, your own club support it even if you somehow don't.....

Are you suggesting that RL in France simply "surrenders" to RU ??

Every club that develops any player, risks them moving away to another club or Union or "down under".

I actually agree with Donny that each club should be developing a certain number of players.
However, you cant prevent them from moving clubs, it's not possible and it doesn't matter if we're talking about Catalan, Wigan or Castleford.
Each club should contribute to the player pool.

I find your comments on Union both interesting and disturbing in equal measure as you could apply those comments to ALL RL clubs and not just to Catalan.
As a sport RL should be trying to grow and improve but, despite having had 70/80 years head start over Union as a professional sport, we look like our decisions are being made by a few blokes in a small room at the back of the Local Working men's club.

As for RL in France becoming a semi professional sport and allowing RU to once again shove League into an ever smaller corner of France, I just despair.

French RL is semi-professional. I read a couple of months ago that there's less money in French RL now than 20 yrs ago. Suppose that's due to the 2008 GFC, if it's true. England have a really good RL team who could win the WC, France don't, England has a full-time RL set-up across the clubs, France does not. It's therefore far less likely for the best English RL talent to go to Union, I don't care if they change RL clubs or go to the NRL, as long as they stay in RL.

Also France is still traumatised by WWII.

I think you are well wide of the mark. I see Catalans as a 'real' team with history, and a good sized loyal fanbase that attend because they love RL not due to unsustainable cheap or free tickets.

Yes the travel means they won't ever take the largest crowd to Wembley, but the issue with Cup final crowds is the decline in neutral crowds. No team in SL can sell 45k tickets each to sell the place out, most struggle to shift 20k, neutrals are key and they have lost interest over the last 10 years or so (multiple reasons, scheduling on a Bank Holiday with poor travel options, loss of social clubs, amateur teams and who all used to fill a coach, launch of the Magic Weekend as an alternative RL weekend away)

I would like to see more French players come through, but they have to remain competitive and that means established British or Anz players are often a better option.

I would agree the French National Team haven't progressed, but that seems to be due to a lack of competitive games and some odd coaching choices (several British coaches with no links to France and not fluent in the language) it is not Catalans responsibility to fix the National side.

Well, for starters.

Expanding the footprint of professional RL
Excellent facilities and decent crowds
Attracted the largest attendance for any regular SL game (outside of Magic Weekend).
Attracting some star signings - Folou, although loved and hated in equal measure is certainly a world class player
First no English club to win a major RL Trophy
Somewhere different to watch SL

I too could go on but, it would probably be wasting my breath

IF RL was brave enough, just imagine what magic would be like held in the Camp Nou.

I know that Bradford aren't in SL (yet) but, Barcelona would be a fantastic place to go for the weekend and watch a major rl event and it would do more for the sport than staging the event in Manchester but, RL lacks ambition.
Certainly if Toulouse were to get the "golden ticket", a "Magic" event in Catalonia or France would be superb -covid permitting, of course

I'm not sure that Catalan (or Toulouse) are semi pro ??
As for less money in the sport over there, I'll take your word for it but, the same could probably be said for RL in the UK too.
It certainly looks like there will be less cash swilling around after the next TV deal.
Your comment about French players being more likely to go to Union is crazy.
If there were no professional RL players in France, any player wanting to make a living in "rugby" would have to go to Union to make a living and you seem to be advocating this ??

"Traumatised by WW11" and yet it is you who wants to wave the white flag for them
Btw, that's a shocking comment and not relevant to this chat, in any way, shape or form. Quite appalling.

This. Its not like the other clubs are producing quality players. Very far from it.

How anyone can claim with a straight face the profile of the competition has got worse due to Catalan I have no idea? Does one seriously think replacing Catalan with some northern town is suddenly going to raise profile of SL lol?

The profile has gotten worse as the competition has got worse year on year. The best players leave the competition but that's nothing to do with Catalan.

Then either yes or no, players are developed through St Esteve to play for Catalans. I’m presuming that encourages community youth development. They may do it a different way but the outcome is still the same.

So, you take out the 2 professional clubs that compete in SL and The Championship and declare the rest as non professional
Why not go the whole hog and take out the English Clubs in those leagues and say that the game over here is the same.

The fact is that Catalan and Toulouse pay their players, hence, they are professional RL clubs in France.

I'm afraid it is. Richard Lewis was highly vocal about the fact that to raise Rugby leagues profile we needed more top class international games. Therefore Catalans were invited into Superleague so they could give leading French players a pathway to professionalism and the French national side. The year after their inclusion France.v.Great Britain tests re-started accordingly.

And no Catalans were not burdened with an instruction to be the French national side, only create a pathway for quality French RL players and aspiring young French players to reach the top. French players were just as welcome to go to St.Helens like Theo Farges did - quite a number of French lads have played in English sides.

in 2006 Casty, Fellous, Mouinis, Rinaldi, Guisset, Frasayinous, Fakir, Bosc, Verges and Fellous Etc were regulars in the side.

But Gausch had no interest in the French National side and as the years went by the French side suffered and the GB.v.France tests were pulled.

That only spurred Gausch on to abandon any idea of growing French Pro-RL and creating a pathway for youngsters. He had run an academy but shut that down, and progressively he brought in English and Antipodean players in order to try to win himself cups, which he did with the Wembley final win.

Buoyed by this he presided over a policy that didn't encourage French players anymore. gigot left, Maria and Simon were not played much. Albert and Morgue who were promising players didn't play at all towards the end of this season and French players like Seguire ,were sat on the bench for the full duration of games.

What point there ever was to Catalans has disappeared....... Expansion they are not......