Except sport is different to business. There aren't dedicated fans of businesses like there are of sports clubs. And if BP, Tesco etc go under someone else rises to take their place, it doesn't spell the potential end of the oil or supermarket industry.

There are only a very small amount of pro RL clubs. For 1 to go under is a disaster for not only the company that owns that club but also the entire RL "industry".
So actually how much you spend, on what and the financial status of your club is very much someone else's business. It's the fans business, it's other clubs business and it's definitely the RFL's business.

I mentioned it earlier in the thread, but why shouldn't a club borrow against its assets? Leeds have considerable assets and need to upgrade the stadium. They'll have to borrow in some fashion to pay for the upgrade, why can't they borrow against their assets?

It's not where the money is raised from that's the issue, it's what it's spent on and how it's to be paid back.

Well except they aren't free to negotiate their wage in a free market as an RL player. There is a cap on salaries. We called it a salary cap. I see no point in the mental gymnastics that are required to pretend that a salary cap, called a salary cap, put in place to cap salaries, justified on the basis that it keeps wages low does not limit a players earnings.

If it doesn't limit players earnings there would literally be no point to it and it couldn't by any definition be called a salary cap.

More importantly it's the players livelihood.

And I'm pretty sure that BPs contractors would be effected by BP going under. And I'm certain Tescos suppliers would be effected by it

While we argue the rights and wrongs of our salary cap Saracens ceo calls for the total abolition of The RU cap in response to Dan Carters move to Racing Metro.

There's a salary cap in lots of jobs. No matter how well I perform in my current role I will not be allowed to negotiate a higher salary, there's an upper ceiling and it's fixed. So trying to use the argument that players are being hard done by just doesn't wash.

Indeed, if you work for the NHS, the 4th largest employer in the world your wage is restricted to the pay scales for your job.

Correct and of course 'old Smokey' knows this and to coin/paraphrase one of his phrases, more importantly so do the players. It will be no great shock to lads in the academy what their potential income will be, they won't reach 21 suddenly think where's my £20k per week.

Although I agree with the sentiment that there are plenty of players that deserve to be paid more, when you compare what they do week in week out to other sports, the market is what the market is.

I never said players are being hard done by, it is (as Malcolm McClaren points out for dairy farmers) their career choice.

Nor do I deny that there are many horrendously low paid , dead end jobs out there!

My disgruntlement is about people being told what they can and what they can't spend their money, a situation which has already proven to NOT protect clubs from financial difficulties/bankruptcy/insolvency etc.

Is that an internal policy for the company you work for or a binding agreement negotiated by your company and its competitors.

Yes they are, what % of a clubs cap they are paid is up to them and the club ,if they dont like it they can move clubs, move to another country or to a different industry, like anybody else

As has been alluded to, for any club to operate it needs other clubs, true businesses dont, if Toyota were the only maufacturer of cars it doesnt spell the end of motoring , with the introduction of ' financial fair play ' the vast majority of sports in the world have or are introducing salary caps of 1 form or another, for RL to contemplate doing the opposite would kill the sport stone dead

The NHS has an internal pay structure. They have not colluded with their competitors to limit wages industry wide.

I agree, Sport is different to business.

I don't believe owners should be able to borrow against the clubs assets, because owners come and go, and how many more times do we see a club lose it's home once their fortunes blow differently. Owners are basically gambling that the current market will remain as is, so they can make those payments, when they can't because of a change in fortune or the market itself, it's the club that suffers, not the idiot who put the club in that position!

Then it isn't freely negotiated is it. Within your first sentence you explain the collusion and restrictions. They are free to do other jobs, so is anyone. They aren't free sell their skills as rl players in an open market

Pretty much every business has relationships with other companies and would be effected by their demise.

FFP is not a salary cap and football did not think it could practically or legally apply one and RU are likely to get rid of theirs and clubs have spoken publicly about their belief it is illegal.

I think the NHS is a good example. I am employed by a particular NHS trust but my wages are capped by the Government. So just like a rugby player I am free to move from one club (Trust) to another but I will not be able to earn more than a maximum for my particular pay scale.

but that's only internally within the NHS. You could go work for a private healthcare provider (if your skills are in demand) and negotiate your own pay with them. So its not the same. The analogue there is the NHS (1 club) and private healthcare providers (other clubs)

If leeds for instance want to have their own internal pay structure and players cannot earn more than that pay scale then that is absolutely fine. If Salford want to have a different one that better fits what they think is best for their business then that should also be fine. If a player has skills to sell, then he should be able to sell them to the highest bidder. The skils an RL player has to sell are, unsurprisingly, being an RL player and a man should be able to freely sell those skills for their value (which a market decides, but we don't have a free market, we have one in which the owners have colluded to deprive those people their market worth as RL players)