FORUMS > The Virtual Terrace > How many times.... |
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[quote="Frank Zappa":1sacjrvf]Some scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute that. I say there is more stupidity than hydrogen, and that is the basic building block of the universe.[/quote:1sacjrvf]
[quote="The_Enforcer":1sacjrvf]Most idiotic post ever goes to Grimmy..... The way to restart should be an arm wrestle between a designated player from each side.[/quote:1sacjrvf]: |
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| Quote: Him "I’d go to a 16 or even 20 team licensed SL. Play everyone once and then play the other 7 or 9 from your half of the table again.
Would give 24 or 29 league games per year including Magic weekend. Then a top 8 playoff.'"
I'd go 15 (the current SL plus Toronto, Tolouse and London), not sure we have a 16th team who is ready to be honest, and two bye weeks may be useful to sides with mounting injury concerns/a cup run. Everyone plays each other twice (28 games) then a top 7 play off as follows:
Week 1 (Quarter finals)
2nd v 7th
3rd v 6th
4th v 5th
Week 2 (Semi finals)
1st v Lowest ranked week 1 winner
Highest ranked week 1 winner v Middle ranked week 1 winner
Week 3 (Final)
The two winners from week 2
Bottom team to play the top team from the Championship over two rounds (home and away) for the final spot in SL. If they are level on points and points difference (unlikely), then keep the status quo. No relegation in year 1 to allow Toronto, Tolouse and London to get up to speed. 1 years' exemption from relegation for any team who earns promotion thereafter as long as they run an academy or reserves which completes all its fixtures.
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| Quote: wrencat1873 "As long as it doesn't have a WF post code, it will be ok.'"
I am not aware of any suitable stadiums with a WF postcode that have the required health and safety certification
No fear......Toulouse, London and Halifax are only in the Q's to give Widnes and Salford someone to beat before those 2 sides meet in the MPG. Next year, your already plummeting attendances will be hit by the loss of one of those GIANTS of the sport and their associated hoards of fans...the financial impact could be crippling ....especially if you get them in the Cup at home.....
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| P and R works in football because the teams at the top of the Championship are pretty much as good as those at the bottom of the Premiership. The same generally cannot be said of Rugby League. I would not mind having an expanded top division that would be P and R free for a couple of years to allow new candidate teams to bed in or even for some teams to have a licence that protects them for a certain time. I know that it would lead to a lot of dead rubbers but so does any simple P and R system.
Personally I like the 3x8 system although I know that it is not popular. More of the games have value although it ultimately makes promotion more difficult. I also agree that we devalue individual games by clubs playing each other so often. Perhaps we need to know how many teams could realistically survive at Super League level and go from there. It seems a shame to have teams with Super League costs playing a division down and living on the edge like Leigh.
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| Should be 14 teams play each other home and away plus magic (with the matches based on league position) with the 14th club relegated and have the million pound game between the top 2 in the championship.
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simpsons/simp006.gif :simpsons/simp006.gif |
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| Quote: Levrier "P and R works in football because the teams at the top of the Championship are pretty much as good as those at the bottom of the Premiership. The same generally cannot be said of Rugby League. I would not mind having an expanded top division that would be P and R free for a couple of years to allow new candidate teams to bed in or even for some teams to have a licence that protects them for a certain time. I know that it would lead to a lot of dead rubbers but so does any simple P and R system.
Personally I like the 3x8 system although I know that it is not popular. More of the games have value although it ultimately makes promotion more difficult. I also agree that we devalue individual games by clubs playing each other so often. Perhaps we need to know how many teams could realistically survive at Super League level and go from there. It seems a shame to have teams with Super League costs playing a division down and living on the edge like Leigh.'"
I disagree with you there.
Every club that gains promotion from The Championship in Football has one aim and one aim only, to survive their first season and then look to build, pretty similar to RL.
What they dont have is 1/3 of the clubs battling it out in a "survival league" every season.
They do have to avoid the relegation spots but, in effect, this is 3 from 20, rather than 4 from 12.
Every promoted side in football has to strengthen their squad, just as any promoted side in RL.
Going back to RL, the obvious solution would be to include both Toronto and Toulouse and find out just how both they and the game itself can cope with them in the top flight.
1 up 1 down again seems blindingly obvious and if we have to have the theatre of the MPG then, so be it but, it really isnt necessary.
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75357_1559488330.jpeg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_75357.jpeg |
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| What would help is if Magic Weekend wasn’t an extra game and it was changed to:
Play the same team two years running
Year 1 it takes the place of the home game of Team A
Year 2 it takes the place of the home game of Team B
You wouldn’t have that unneeded extra game then
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62021_1514912988.png [img:12j4q57k]https://i.imgur.com/ayH2ksC.jpg[/img:12j4q57k]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_62021.png |
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| Quote: Psychedelic Casual "What would help is if Magic Weekend wasn’t an extra game and it was changed to
Unless team A or Team B were relegated in year 1.
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"I have this system where I support England first, then the other Home Nations, then the rest of the Commonwealth, then the rest of the World, then France.": |
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| To me, by far the most important goal needs to be making the Championship a valid competition in its own right. If the only importance of winning the Championship is getting to Super League then no licensing system can ever fill the needs of the game. If, on the other hand, we can create a situation where the Championship level is regarded as a competition worth winning simply for its own sake and is self-sustaining then we can start to talk about licensing systems, moratoriums on p&r for promoted teams and so on. The most obvious difference between Britain and Australia is that all the sides below the NRL, in Queensland Cup and so on, do fine where they are. Their whole existence is not based on reaching the NRL because that is the only way to be successful. How this is to be achieved is the hard part but I would suggest we need to start by looking at the goals of clubs - do all clubs want to be full-time professional outfits, for example? I'd like to see a separate broadcast deal for the Championship and I would like to see a new England or GB team added to the structure that selects only Championship players, giving those players something else to aim for and creating a team that would probably be good competition for nations below tier 1. Basically, celebrate the Championship!
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438_1551258406.jpg "If you start listening to the fans it won't be long before you're sitting with them," - Wayne Bennett.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_438.jpg |
Moderator
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| Quote: tyr "To me, by far the most important goal needs to be making the Championship a valid competition in its own right. If the only importance of winning the Championship is getting to Super League then no licensing system can ever fill the needs of the game. If, on the other hand, we can create a situation where the Championship level is regarded as a competition worth winning simply for its own sake and is self-sustaining then we can start to talk about licensing systems, moratoriums on p&r for promoted teams and so on. The most obvious difference between Britain and Australia is that all the sides below the NRL, in Queensland Cup and so on, do fine where they are. Their whole existence is not based on reaching the NRL because that is the only way to be successful. How this is to be achieved is the hard part but I would suggest we need to start by looking at the goals of clubs - do all clubs want to be full-time professional outfits, for example? I'd like to see a separate broadcast deal for the Championship and I would like to see a new England or GB team added to the structure that selects only Championship players, giving those players something else to aim for and creating a team that would probably be good competition for nations below tier 1. Basically, celebrate the Championship!'"
P&R has existed since the move from one division (barring a few years in SL). That has meant that a lot of clubs have moved between divisions in that time. I’d expect all those clubs to believe that they should be capable of playing at elite level again. If they don’t already play in SL then they aspire to at some stage. Remove that possibility and you remove the motivation for many players and supporters and then if you do that you remove the attraction to sponsors.
How do you retain the motivation and attraction without the aspiration to play in SL? I think a separate broadcast deal is great in theory but I doubt it would generate the income and prestige that would be needed to retain interest. RL at elite level struggles to be taken seriously in the media so I imagine at a semi-pro level the challenge would be even greater. It’s a crowded market in the UK in comparison with Australia where RL is the dominant winter sport in NSW and Queensland.
Some teams don’t aspire to be fulltime but the middle 8s offers a chance for them to test themselves, get a big payday and some TV coverage. Many know that they’re probably not realistically going up but the illusion of a chance to go up is enough to maintain the interest.
I like the idea of a championship rep side. That would be a thing for players to aspire to and put themselves in the shop window. It might also be a useful trial game for England or England Kinights. A lot of fans, myself included, would welcome a chance to see Championship players smack some SL bigheads.
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76960_1533043896.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_76960.jpg |
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| RL needs to pull completely away from the influence of soccer. Even the old RFL logo was similar to the EFL logo ffs.
RL should align with the NRL. They know how to make a general success of the sport. Drop the whole 'Super League' branding as well. It's dated and irrelevant as phook.
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Black Backgrounds/Rowlf%20the%20Dog.gif :Black Backgrounds/Rowlf%20the%20Dog.gif |
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| Quote: RLRealist "Drop the whole 'Super League' branding as well. It's dated and irrelevant as phook.'"
Maybe rename it Premier League.
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76960_1533043896.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_76960.jpg |
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| Quote: Muggins "Maybe rename it Premier League.
Rugby League sounds good. That could work.
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2244_1299706258.jpg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_2244.jpg |
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| Quote: RLRealist "RL needs to pull completely away from the influence of soccer. Even the old RFL logo was similar to the EFL logo ffs.
RL should align with the NRL. They know how to make a general success of the sport. Drop the whole 'Super League' branding as well. It's dated and irrelevant as phook.'"
I agree RL should copy the NRL. They have the right structure in place in my opinion.
I don’t think we should move away from soccer though, I think we should move toward it. I think we have more in common with soccer than Union for instance and should target football fans in specific areas. If we were doing a rebrand of clubs I’d tie some in with local football teams. Even see if some football clubs want to take over the RL club and run it jointly alongside the football.
Where we should follow Union’s lead is with internationals. They’ve nailed it.
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| Quote: wrencat1873 "I disagree with you there.
………..
1 up 1 down again seems blindingly obvious and if we have to have the theatre of the MPG then, so be it but, it really isnt necessary.'"
All fair points but the problem always remains that in RL the team going up is always the most likely team to go back down because they do not have enough time to prepare sucessfully and unlike in football, where there is enough money to protect the relegated team from the cost of their promotion run, the relegated RL team will always suffer. The perfect solution would be to have a vibrant Championship where the wealth of the two leagues is not so different that it does not matter. Until that happens we just recycle the same players who get relegated every year.
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simpsons/simp006.gif :simpsons/simp006.gif |
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| Quote: Levrier "All fair points but the problem always remains that in RL the team going up is always the most likely team to go back down because they do not have enough time to prepare sucessfully and unlike in football, where there is enough money to protect the relegated team from the cost of their promotion run, the relegated RL team will always suffer. The perfect solution would be to have a vibrant Championship where the wealth of the two leagues is not so different that it does not matter. Until that happens we just recycle the same players who get relegated every year.'"
Yes, pretty much as it is in the round ball game.
Unless you are going to exempt any promoted side from relegation the following season, this will always be the cas, unless there war parity in income/spending power between SL and the promoted club.
As the saying goes, you cant have everything and at least any promoted side gets their shot at "the big time".
Also, with one up one down, at least any promoted side would avoid the nonsense that we have now (the qualifiers), where half a dozen clubs fron SL and the Championship will perpetually struggle to build and strengthen their side.
How many decent players would want to go to a side that would be in jeopardy at the end of the season and if they do, just how much will they want to be paid, in relation to going to a "safe" club, which gives the top 6 a massive advantage both in terms of recruitment and salary cap spend.
They will still want more to play for a Widnes or Wakefield, compared to Wigan or Saints but, again, that's life.
Having said that, the current system does prevent as many dead rubbers as there are under the 1 up/ 1 down system and for the neutral, the middle 8's is probably more compelling viewing than the race for a top 4 spot, especially this season when the current top 4 are almost certain to be the semi finalists.
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