To be fair, he was a bit overhyped during his younger days at Castleford bit like Sneyd. Added a bit to their value but did neither any favours. Had a shocker last night but generally a steady eddie.

Still waiting for him to win 1 or even two moan if steel awards, as promised by Phil Clarke and the rugby gods.

Westerman looks to me like he is carrying 10-12 kg of extra fat, mostly around his face, needs to lean up a bit.

He moved to Hull. The attitude around the place is crippling. Not to be patronising but I do hope for the sake of Super League - there's a strong Hull side in my lifetime. The fans deserve it for their loyalty to such utter dross.

I thought the Horne brothers, especially Richard Horne was going to be a world beater. Never happened.
Yeaman. Great potential. Never happened.
Ellis, bit older and clapped-out perhaps. Hasn't set the world on fire.

Of course, it's an overreaction. But it seems like playing for Hull in the last 10 years, seems like an incredible mental burden.

I don't think many people saw Graeme Horne as a future World beater. He has however developed into a very fine and dependable player. We certainly miss his presence when he's out.

He had one of those games tonight but that doesn't make him a bad player, on another night those passes stick and he scores a hat trick.

The point is that he continually put himself in the right place at the right time which is a skill in itself and he kept his head up despite having a mare with his hands.

Defensively he was superb getting to or close to 50 tackles before being subbed due to injury!

You were making a semi decent point until you mentioned Ellis. I'm not sure what more you could expect from him this year, he's been outstanding.

Thanks for saving me the effort of typing the same. It would have been easy for him to avoid putting himself in those positions in the first place.

Must be a Hull thing Jordan Abdul looks like he carrying at least 20kg most than he should - how can a young professional athlete be let this happen?

Even playing at prop he should not be carrying this excess fat but to play him in the halves seems madness.

I said this in the thread about England second-rowers when someone suggested him. He must cost Hull so many points with stupid plays inside the oppositions 20m. It's like he suddenly thinks he's Johnathan Thurston. Don't think I've ever seen him do anything amazing.

Whereas O'Loughlin is error free!

You were wrong then and you're wrong now

Yes, agreed on Abdul. He looked like a pub team player.

Just watching the game, he is dire lol.

Forgive me. Would you like to address my half-decent argument then? I'm curious.

In regards to Ellis. I think he tries his best, and his attitude is without question. But from memory, he cuts a frustrated figure with what's going on around him. And that's more my point, the mental aspect of the Hull club.

He's got all the skill. But he plays like someone who struggles to put one foot in front of the other without someone explaining the act step by step.