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Club Coach | 689 | Wakefield Trinity |
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| Quote Grimmy="Grimmy"I'd reduce its use to a coaches' challenge system. Coaches can have 2 challenges each, which can only be used at stoppages. Let them keep challenging if they are shown to be correct. This would also hopefully reduce the amount of criticism they throw at refs, as the simple retort would be "Well why didn't you challenge it at the time?". Of course there is the chance that they could keep challenging correctly, thus undermining the on field ref, but that would probably deserve scrutiny, if it happened. I'd also extend use of video ref to include serious foul play (i.e red card offences only). We don't want players staying on the pitch, then getting long bans afterwards.
Other than that, leave it with the on-field team. Having a better atmosphere/product is more important than the odd difficult call the match officials may get wrong IMO, and we would do better to focus more on the action, and less on the refs.'"
There is some merit in your ideas, I particularly like the coaches challenge thing; it seems to work in tennis.
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International Star | 106 | No Team Selected |
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| My problem with a challenge system is it could be even more anti-climatic. If a team scores a late try and the opposition has a challenge left, they would just use it speculatively and hope something is wrong, and that would take some of the excitement of a late, winning try away.
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Player Coach | 1999 | Halifax R.L.F.C. |
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| I think it works well as it is. If the ref is sure, then he awards a try. If he has any doubt then he can go to the VR. By making the match ref make an on-field decision, this means that the VR has a default position if the decision is unclear. The one thing I'd change is to restrict the VR to the number of replays he can view. After viewing the play from every camera available, give him one more look from one camera, and if he still can't make a decision then go with the original match official decision.
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Club Captain | 1858 | No Team Selected |
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| i have 2 issues with the current system, firstly the ref sending it up as a try/no try is nonsense, if he ref has to send it up it means he isn’t sure so let the VR make the decision. Secondly I think there should be a time limit on a VR decision, if he can’t make his mind up within a set period of time a try should be awarded.
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International Chairman | 12792 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| I've no issue with the field referee sending it up as a try / no try. What he is essentially saying here is "unless you can find evidence to the contrary, I am going to award a try". I think that's a better and more transparent system than the "benefit of the doubt to the attacking side" approach we had previously.
Most of the issues of the VR seem to be rooted in interpretation. The VR is great for binary questions ("did the player's foot go in touch?", "was the player behind the kicker?" etc). Where it becomes problematic is where the VR is asked to judge any shade of grey - things like obstructions or whether an aerial challenge for the ball was fair - because we're moving into one man's judgement over another. Football is experiencing the same issues with VAR.
Thursday night's game and Hull KR's disallowed try was a classic example, where the VR was asked to rule whether "Carl Ablett might have possibily, had he not been impeded (if indeed he was impeded), effected some sort of challenge on Danny McGuire that may have affected his kick". We'll see incidents like that referred to the video week after week, and different weeks the same referee will give different decisions.
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Club Owner | 7735 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote bramleyrhino="bramleyrhino"If he's talking about the NRL's "Bunker" model, then I'd agree with Guscott. If he's talking about the Super League model, then I don't agree.
Guscott doesn't actually say much about the parts of RL's video referee model he likes. He just says "it's quick and we get it right" - and that's a very broad generalisation to make.'"
Not sure it needs to be a detailed appraisal when he nails it in his comment. Not sure what else you need with a video ref other then speed and accuracy.
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International Chairman | 12792 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Quote Mild mannered Janitor="Mild mannered Janitor"Not sure it needs to be a detailed appraisal when he nails it in his comment. Not sure what else you need with a video ref other then speed and accuracy.'"
I don't think he does nail it when there are clearly cases where our system isn't quick, and when we don't always get it right.
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| Quote bramleyrhino="bramleyrhino"I don't think he does nail it when there are clearly cases where our system isn't quick, and when we don't always get it right.'"
Nothing is 100% efficient. You cannot quote a handful of cases when the vast majority are dealt with swiftly and without controversy.
I would be interested to know the average length of time it takes for a VR decision to come through. 60 seconds on average? Isn't that the length of time a kicker has to tee up a shot after a try? Perhaps they should encourage the kicker to tee up the shot whilst the VR is decision is pending. There would be no time lost in that situation.
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International Star | 22205 | Leigh Centurions |
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| Quote Trainman="Trainman"i have 2 issues with the current system, firstly =#FF0000the ref sending it up as a try/no try is nonsense,=#FF0000 if the ref has to send it up it means he isn’t sure so let the VR make the decision. Secondly I think there should be a time limit on a VR decision, if he can’t make his mind up within a set period of time a try should be awarded.'"
Correct, and that should be it. The VR then goes back to the ptb, to see if there are any infringements leading up to, and the actual grounding of the ball,then make his decision.
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Moderator | 32210 | Bradford Bulls |
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| Quote bramleyrhino="bramleyrhino"I've no issue with the field referee sending it up as a try / no try. What he is essentially saying here is "unless you can find evidence to the contrary, I am going to award a try". I think that's a better and more transparent system than the "benefit of the doubt to the attacking side" approach we had previously.
Most of the issues of the VR seem to be rooted in interpretation. The VR is great for binary questions ("did the player's foot go in touch?", "was the player behind the kicker?" etc). Where it becomes problematic is where the VR is asked to judge any shade of grey - things like obstructions or whether an aerial challenge for the ball was fair - because we're moving into one man's judgement over another. Football is experiencing the same issues with VAR.
Thursday night's game and Hull KR's disallowed try was a classic example, where the VR was asked to rule whether "Carl Ablett might have possibily, had he not been impeded (if indeed he was impeded), effected some sort of challenge on Danny McGuire that may have affected his kick". We'll see incidents like that referred to the video week after week, and different weeks the same referee will give different decisions.'"
That sums up my thinking completely. It’s the “shades of grey” decisions that are the most contentious and take the most time. I think a time limit should be in operation for those. If no decision is arrived at in say 40secs then go with the onfield ruling.
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| I see it a bit differently. If there were no video referee at the match, the on field referee would have to make a decision. So he is really saying to the video ref, ' If you weren't here I'd give a try / no try - unless you can see I would be clearly wrong...?'
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